Tankie is a gradually shifting pejorative for anyone that defends existing socialist states. Dbzer0 straddles the line between tankie/non-tankie because the average stance is less a defense of existing socialism and more towards skepticism towards allegations against existing socialism, which then depends on who is hurling the pejorative.
At this point tankie just means anyone who acknowledges there is nuance to historical and/or modern socialist states. You don’t even have to support or defend them to earn the pejorative, you get it just for saying that maybe the CIA lied about some things.
Edit: after re-reading your comment I realize I am just repeating what you said.
Yep! You’ve got it. I think it mostly depends on the position of the one hurling the pejorative, anarchists that use it tend to mean MLs and others that support socialist states on principle, while liberals cast a wider net for anyone that doesn’t fully buy the CIA narrative, which includes some liberals and many anarchists.
Honestly most anarchists I’ve encountered tend to reflexively hate socialist states to the point that any nuanced take on them gets you the label without even expressing principled support as an ML. I sometimes think they hate ML socialism more than they hate capitalism, which is wild to me. Like, I think that most anarchists are idealistic and naive, but I still think they are comrades and I would happily live in their version of communism if it somehow came about.
You definitely are describing an unfortunately common phenomenon. Anarchism is not ideologically consistent by nature, it’s more loose, and therefore there is broader ideological breathing room than something as consistent and disciplined as the Marxist-derived ideologies. Many anarchists do end up critically supporting socialism as a consequence.
Tankie is a gradually shifting pejorative for anyone that defends existing socialist states. Dbzer0 straddles the line between tankie/non-tankie because the average stance is less a defense of existing socialism and more towards skepticism towards allegations against existing socialism, which then depends on who is hurling the pejorative.
At this point tankie just means anyone who acknowledges there is nuance to historical and/or modern socialist states. You don’t even have to support or defend them to earn the pejorative, you get it just for saying that maybe the CIA lied about some things.
Edit: after re-reading your comment I realize I am just repeating what you said.
Yep! You’ve got it. I think it mostly depends on the position of the one hurling the pejorative, anarchists that use it tend to mean MLs and others that support socialist states on principle, while liberals cast a wider net for anyone that doesn’t fully buy the CIA narrative, which includes some liberals and many anarchists.
Honestly most anarchists I’ve encountered tend to reflexively hate socialist states to the point that any nuanced take on them gets you the label without even expressing principled support as an ML. I sometimes think they hate ML socialism more than they hate capitalism, which is wild to me. Like, I think that most anarchists are idealistic and naive, but I still think they are comrades and I would happily live in their version of communism if it somehow came about.
You definitely are describing an unfortunately common phenomenon. Anarchism is not ideologically consistent by nature, it’s more loose, and therefore there is broader ideological breathing room than something as consistent and disciplined as the Marxist-derived ideologies. Many anarchists do end up critically supporting socialism as a consequence.