Now you’re only proving their complaint to be valid. Please don’t troll - it just makes your side look at bad as you likely think they are. If you haven’t anything to actually contribute to the discussion, then let us continue without rude distractions, please.
Had it ever occurred to you that US born citizens feel this way, and that after 200 years, we’re tired of the loss-adverse, who lose more each election cycle, preventing us from trying something different than the status quo losing moves?
That kind of why I engage in these discussions - to learn what “trying something different” looks like, and decide for myself if it makes sense, or is worth pursuing.
You’re not entirely wrong about corporate Democrats, but do try to keep in mind that - outside of most blue politicians - the bulk of the blue side constituency is made up of a significantly wider array perspectives than the red side - they’re just blue because there’s no serious alternative.
the bulk of the blue side constituency is made up of a significantly wider array perspectives than the red side
literally just had the same reaction that i could have got from some maga dude, right down to the misgendering in this exact thread. i really hope you can appreciate that this isn’t a new experience for me either.
i live in a blue state, my reps at state and federal are essentially republicans with the serial numbers filed off. as long as you don’t openly say slurs it all flies under the radar in a blue state. money dominates the conversation and people challenging entrenched democrat incumbents get accused of helping the republicans anyways.
i don’t see what benefit there is to participating inside the democratic party in any way. certainly not in voting for it; we don’t even have a popular vote.
literally just had the same reaction that i could have got from some maga dude, right down to the misgendering in this exact thread. i really hope you can appreciate that this isn’t a new experience for me either.
Try to remember everyone’s unique. I can’t answer for that person’s response to you, but I hope you can see mine are different.
But, yeah - I fully get where you’re coming from. I’m the “black sheep” of my family because I’m not on board at all with their right wing crap, and after many years I pretty much instinctively expect the worst out of every Republican because they rarely deviate from the hive mind. Yet, I still wait for them to dig their grave first before being dismissive of them because I always try to treat people how I’d like to be treated and that’s with fairness & understanding.
i don’t see what benefit there is to participating inside the democratic party in any way. certainly not in voting for it; we don’t even have a popular vote.
The progressives taking up more spaces within the party of late show why. You really need to focus on the primaries - work towards keeping the corporate Dems from getting the nomination & we can change things from within. Unfortunately, I’m not really aware of any other credible approach available to us short of an extremely unlikely full-on revolution - but at least there is a path towards change if we work it hard enough.
the problem i see is that ‘change from within’ makes a lot of assumptions about the nature of the party. the party has structural mechanisms to neutralize internal dissent.
thinking about how ‘the squad’ finally came around to endorsing kamala after years of getting boxed out on anything that mattered.
it’s not about waiting for or expecting that ‘the rev’ is imminent either.
what is actually imminent are peoples rising needs. what i think is worth engaging in is the act of creating structures that actually meet people’s needs now, outside the market. something that builds real capacity for change rather than depending on whether the right candidates win primaries inside a party structurally hostile to them.
i don’t think it’s as simple as ‘covering bases’ to be going up against a well-resourced party structure on its own terms and expecting change. to me that is an unrealistic expectation.
i’d rather see challengers running under a different party, i just have zero confidence in the democrats at this point.
i still vote because it’s convenient, i even vote in primaries and municipal. i usually just write in bullshit for all the races that are unopposed or where the democrat also sucks ass. we don’t have a national popular vote so my vote for president is essentially meaningless.
i don’t think it’s as simple as ‘covering bases’ to be going up against a well-resourced party structure on its own terms and expecting change. to me that is an unrealistic expectation.
There are weaknesses in most structures, you just have to find them. The right-wing takeover of the USA has demonstrated this, even if it did take them decades to accomplish it.
i’d rather see challengers running under a different party, i just have zero confidence in the democrats at this point.
There have been other parties for quite some time. They’re lucky to have even 1% of the population’s awareness, however. America’s electoral system virtually guarantee it’ll stay this way, which is why I see disrupting the Democratic party from within as the more likely to be viable approach for the time being. We can work towards progressives splitting off into their own party at some point, but they need to get bigger first or they’ll lose and take their reputations down with that loss.
Move to Russia then boy
i use she/her in case you are unable to read display names
That’s nice
you should edit your comment, or are you just really invested in proving my point?
No. I really shouldn’t and I don’t have to
why don’t you just call me a slur already, you clearly want to and this is all so cowardly
Your username is fitting at least
They are trolling. Plz don’t feed them.
Now you’re only proving their complaint to be valid. Please don’t troll - it just makes your side look at bad as you likely think they are. If you haven’t anything to actually contribute to the discussion, then let us continue without rude distractions, please.
Had it ever occurred to you that US born citizens feel this way, and that after 200 years, we’re tired of the loss-adverse, who lose more each election cycle, preventing us from trying something different than the status quo losing moves?
That kind of why I engage in these discussions - to learn what “trying something different” looks like, and decide for myself if it makes sense, or is worth pursuing.
it’s uncanny how for both blue and red maga it’s the same playbook, just different foreign country they demonize
also thank you i’m fine staying in the us, i like making rackys and owning guns
❤️
You’re not entirely wrong about corporate Democrats, but do try to keep in mind that - outside of most blue politicians - the bulk of the blue side constituency is made up of a significantly wider array perspectives than the red side - they’re just blue because there’s no serious alternative.
literally just had the same reaction that i could have got from some maga dude, right down to the misgendering in this exact thread. i really hope you can appreciate that this isn’t a new experience for me either.
i live in a blue state, my reps at state and federal are essentially republicans with the serial numbers filed off. as long as you don’t openly say slurs it all flies under the radar in a blue state. money dominates the conversation and people challenging entrenched democrat incumbents get accused of helping the republicans anyways.
i don’t see what benefit there is to participating inside the democratic party in any way. certainly not in voting for it; we don’t even have a popular vote.
Try to remember everyone’s unique. I can’t answer for that person’s response to you, but I hope you can see mine are different.
But, yeah - I fully get where you’re coming from. I’m the “black sheep” of my family because I’m not on board at all with their right wing crap, and after many years I pretty much instinctively expect the worst out of every Republican because they rarely deviate from the hive mind. Yet, I still wait for them to dig their grave first before being dismissive of them because I always try to treat people how I’d like to be treated and that’s with fairness & understanding.
The progressives taking up more spaces within the party of late show why. You really need to focus on the primaries - work towards keeping the corporate Dems from getting the nomination & we can change things from within. Unfortunately, I’m not really aware of any other credible approach available to us short of an extremely unlikely full-on revolution - but at least there is a path towards change if we work it hard enough.
the problem i see is that ‘change from within’ makes a lot of assumptions about the nature of the party. the party has structural mechanisms to neutralize internal dissent.
thinking about how ‘the squad’ finally came around to endorsing kamala after years of getting boxed out on anything that mattered.
it’s not about waiting for or expecting that ‘the rev’ is imminent either.
what is actually imminent are peoples rising needs. what i think is worth engaging in is the act of creating structures that actually meet people’s needs now, outside the market. something that builds real capacity for change rather than depending on whether the right candidates win primaries inside a party structurally hostile to them.
I’m on board with that, but I don’t see why the two approaches are mutually exclusive. I don’t see the harm in covering the bases.
i don’t think it’s as simple as ‘covering bases’ to be going up against a well-resourced party structure on its own terms and expecting change. to me that is an unrealistic expectation.
i’d rather see challengers running under a different party, i just have zero confidence in the democrats at this point.
i still vote because it’s convenient, i even vote in primaries and municipal. i usually just write in bullshit for all the races that are unopposed or where the democrat also sucks ass. we don’t have a national popular vote so my vote for president is essentially meaningless.
There are weaknesses in most structures, you just have to find them. The right-wing takeover of the USA has demonstrated this, even if it did take them decades to accomplish it.
There have been other parties for quite some time. They’re lucky to have even 1% of the population’s awareness, however. America’s electoral system virtually guarantee it’ll stay this way, which is why I see disrupting the Democratic party from within as the more likely to be viable approach for the time being. We can work towards progressives splitting off into their own party at some point, but they need to get bigger first or they’ll lose and take their reputations down with that loss.