• 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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    8 hours ago

    the west will never forgive China for liberating themselves, it is a dangerous precedent that should be chastised at all costs.

  • Zweiblum@feddit.org
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    1 day ago

    Ah its nice to see lemmy grow. Now we can have fedderated senseless screaming matches just like the big social networks.

      • subversive_dev@lemmy.ml
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        1 day ago

        The meme assumes the Western context. We don’t trust the US government because of the centuries of violence and exploitation. We had to go looking for that information because it is minimized and buried at every turn by the compliant national media.

        On the other hand, the supposed abuses of the Chinese government are loudly broadcast at every turn. You’ll find if you go looking outside of Western sanctioned sources that all of those criticisms are absurd fabrications.

        Therefore, someone in the western context who says they don’t trust the US or China is trusting the US media for information about China but not about the US itself. Does that help?

        • Valso@lemmy.ml
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          1 day ago

          Yeah, I think it does. But I still don’t get it why the man in the third image is with nearly closed eyes. Is he answering the question by mimicing a Chinese face, meaning China told him not to trust what China says?

          • subversive_dev@lemmy.ml
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            9 hours ago

            I’m a little confused because the comic only has two panels? Additionally, in the second panel the character’s eyes are still round not any other shape - I don’t see squinting at all? (If you were trying to draw a head that small with eyes that were squinting, you would use angled lines, not circles)

            In any case, I believe the interpretation of the comic intended by the creator is: “Panel one represents what Western liberals say about China. Panel 2 represents the media environment they swim in”

            • Valso@lemmy.ml
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              5 hours ago

              If you see only 2 parts of the image, that means your ISP sucks and it doesn’t load the entire image.

          • mendiCAN [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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            1 day ago

            Description: Eye squinting happens when the eyelids are compressed together serving to constrict the eyes. It can sometimes occur in just a fraction of a second before disappearing.

            In One Sentence: Narrowing the eyes is due to physical or emotional pain.

            How To Use it: When you do not like what is being said or seen, simply narrow your eyes. This tells others that you do not like what you are seeing or hearing. You may perform this eye language in brief within just fractions of a seconds. While people may not consciously perceive the signal, it will likely still register subconsciously. If the person for whom the cue is intended, notices, they may revisit their proposal and add additional incentives to ease your negative judgment.

            Context: General.

            Verbal Translation: “What I’m seeing is causing me emotional or physical pain and to prevent all that negativity from coming into my body I’m going to squint and block to resist.”

            Variant: See Anger Facial Expression, Hand To Eye Gesture.

            Cue In Action: a) A person will wince when reading objectionable portions of a contract. b) She winced when the student missed the correct note on the piano. It caused her visceral pain.

            Meaning and/or Motivation: An eye blocking form of body language designed to prohibit distasteful images or even thoughts from being received at full view. Narrowing eyes indicates contempt, distaste and anger. A person will not only squint from seeing objectionable sights, but also negative thoughts or sounds.

            Wincing falls into the category of microexpressions since it can happen in only fractions of a second before disappearing, yet it remains full of meaning.

      • NOT_RICK@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        He’s saying anyone that claims to not trust the West nor China only distrusts China because they were propagandized by western news sources.

        I don’t find that particularly compelling because I think assuming someone’s information diet and discarding it in order to invalidate their view is lazy. I’ll leave it at that so I don’t get put in timeout.

  • ter_maxima@jlai.lu
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    2 days ago

    China bad. US bad. Russia bad.

    All three can be true at the same time. (And they are)

      • folaht@lemmy.ml
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        10 hours ago

        Except for that one little village where people like Germanix lives.

      • ter_maxima@jlai.lu
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        1 day ago

        Bold of you to assume I am American, did you not check the instance I am from ?

        Yes, there are many lies about China, but don’t get stuck in second opinion syndrome. China is both worse and better than you know.

        The fact the government lies about China, while China is still bad behind the scenes, can both be true. During the cold war, both sides accused the other of being evil, and both were right.

        Don’t let anyone who puts a “communist” sticker on their own forehead fool you into supporting them.

        • Dessalines@lemmy.ml
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          1 day ago

          The fact the government lies about China, while China is still bad behind the scenes, can both be true.

          This is just vague-posting unless you actually link some credible china-bad studies that aren’t sourced from British or US state media.

          • ThirdConsul@lemmy.ml
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            1 day ago

            some credible china-bad studies that aren’t sourced from British or US state media.

            University of Limpopo, South Africa, on China neocolonising Africa - https://www.jstor.org/stable/27159668. Is that credible enough for you?

            If not, is there a source that you would call credible - and if it exists, what is it?

            Note: I hope I don’t come as aggressive, I was trying to be succinct.

          • rottingleaf@lemmy.world
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            1 day ago

            Something like a one-party political system with dear respected leader, concentration camps, surveillance, social rating system, GFW?

            Note how I don’t say anything about propaganda from every crack. That’s because western propaganda has successfully evolved in the conditions of outright censorship not being allowed. Like killing cockroaches in a building again and again you make them evolve for the poisons used in the past.

            If you are going to pick the “all this is not credible” line, then don’t bother. Also credible is a synonym for “believable”, and nobody can make you believe things you don’t want to believe.

            • Thebigguy@lemmy.ml
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              17 hours ago

              The USA is a one party system in many ways so is the EU when it comes to imperialist and neoliberal policies every single party is on board doesn’t matter who you vote for.

            • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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              1 day ago

              Can you name a single piece of anti-China propaganda from the West that you don’t accept unquestioningly?

      • scintilla@beehaw.org
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        2 days ago

        This is why people won’t support lemmy lmao.

        You know there are other sources for China’s ills than American news media right?

    • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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      2 days ago

      “The US is bad, but I believe everything it says about its enemies without question”

      • shiftymccool@programming.dev
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        2 days ago

        It doesn’t matter who said it. There isn’t a company or a government that is your “friend”. They’re all out to squeeze you

        • 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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          8 hours ago

          China has never done anything wrong to my country while the US has and continues to do so, how insane you have to be to group them together.

        • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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          2 days ago

          You should probably stop unquestionably believing everything the US says about its enemies then

          • shiftymccool@programming.dev
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            2 days ago

            What is it about my comment that makes you think i do? Fuck ALL corporations. Fuck ALL governments. Is that clear enough?

            • Dessalines@lemmy.ml
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              1 day ago

              It’s clear that you equate an empire’s atrocities with their victim country’s self defense.

              Saying “all governments are equally bad” while the US is bombing them outright or funding their destruction is tone-deaf.

                • pinkapple@lemmy.ml
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                  9 hours ago

                  Classic US foreign policy propaganda. It’s not Uyghurs, it’s specific fanatical jihadi separatists among Uyghurs who made a guest appearance among the other head choppers in Syria after the government fell and are openly looking for international support to do the same in China. You’re completely wrong if you think that all Uyghurs want to live under Sharia law in some Uyghurstan.

                  You’re basically an ISIS supporter.

                • Dessalines@lemmy.ml
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                  1 day ago

                  The majority of the world, notably Islamic countries, who’ve been bombed by US and british planes for almost a century now, disagree with you. Only the countries aligned with the US empire are buying this line.

                  You can also just go to Xinjiang, and see for yourself, unlike the main person peddling this narrative, Adrian Zenz, an anti-semitic evangelical who works for the US government, and doesn’t speak a word of mandarin.

                  https://dessalines.github.io/essays/socialism_faq.html#whats-going-on-with-the-uyghurs

            • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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              1 day ago

              The fact that you only do this “all lives matter!” style equivocation in one direction.

              Fuck ALL corporations. Fuck ALL governments. Is that clear enough?

              Oh? So can I get a “fuck the government of Ukraine”? How about “fuck the government of Taiwan.” How about “Fuck the republican party AND the Democratic party, neither of them are your friend, they’re both out to squeeze you”? (The last one being very different from what you were saying during the election, where, for some reason, your “everyone is bad, maaaan!” stance was nowhere to be seen…)

              • seralth@lemmy.world
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                15 hours ago

                Do you just believe people can’t be anarchists…? Cause that guy just seems to be an anarchist.

                • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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                  15 hours ago

                  To be an anarchist you actually have to consistently hold anarchist positions. Not being a liberal 99% of the time and only bringing out the facade of anarchism when you need to justify acting like a western chauvinist.

                  You can’t be an anarchist and a fanatical supporter of the democratic party at the same time

    • anon@lemmings.world
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      1 day ago

      Exactly. That is what bothers me about most anti Americans here in Europe. The US absolutely did many terrible things, but that does not automatically mean that the Russians are the good ones. They did many terrible things too.

      • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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        1 day ago

        Historically, Western Europe has been just as bad as the US, especially France, Germany, and the UK. Russia hasn’t been as bad historically, especially not when they were Socialist, when they were inarguably one of the most progressive countries in the world.

        • anon@lemmings.world
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          1 day ago

          I’m talking about the time post world war two. And if you are telling me that the soviet occupations and invasions weren’t horrific, I can’t help you

          • 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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            7 hours ago

            i find it more horrific that the US supported head chopping jihadists in afghanistan to prevent a soviet aligned democratic goverment there. and in every other interventions, the US found themselves on the reactionaries side, and still continue to do so to this day with the headchopping wahhabis in Syria for example.

          • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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            1 day ago

            The period where the Soviet Union supported Cuba, Palestine, Algeria, Vietnam, China, and countless other liberatory struggles? Where the Soviets sent the first human to space before the US? Where the hard effort in building up an industrialized society was beginning to pay off greatly despite the devastation suffered during World War II?

            Yes, the Soviet Union was far more progressive than the US and Western Europe in that period, where the western countries were busy committing genocide, colonialism, imperialism, and more. I don’t need your “help” if your worldview fundamentally rests on excusing genocide and twisting a country that aided in the liberation of many countries as worse than that, somehow.

      • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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        1 day ago

        No one has ever said they were, it’s just a lazy strawman westerners use so they never have to justify always treating their countries as the good guys.

    • 小莱卡@lemmygrad.ml
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      6 hours ago

      they come with pitchforks out whenever china is framed remotively positive, straight up reinforces the meme lol

    • jackeroni@lemmy.mlOP
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      20 hours ago

      hah! you aint’ kiddin, focused on real-life stuff for a bit and came back to a 40+ inbox 😁 😆

    • folaht@lemmy.ml
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      Usians don’t like being told that their stolen land nation started by slave owners who then held a “freedom revolution” so these oligarchs to have to pay taxes while tge rest of their population does, isn’t such a great place after all.

  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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    2 days ago

    It is nice to see the western propaganda machine start to fail. I never thought I’d see the general public recognize Israel is a genocidal settler apartheid state until the last couple years, even though the propaganda machine has been working overtime for it. Hopefully other areas in propaganda start to crumble as well.

    • jackeroni@lemmy.mlOP
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      Born to early to explore the cosmos, too late to explore the world, but just in time to see the fall of the US empire propaganda machine 😁

  • Infamousblt [any]@hexbear.net
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    I am a Rational Free Thinker and that’s why I only consume privately funded US media that cites US intelligence

  • veganbtw@lemmy.ml
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    2 days ago

    Noooo my heckin wholesome Lemmy propaganda don’t you dare have any other opinion than USA#1 here or else me and my liberal friends will call your love of gross, dirty and smelly foreigners and make homophobic jokes about you having sex with Putin

    • frippa@lemmy.ml
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      2 days ago

      When you have to resort to attack your opponent by using their post history you know that either you lost or you dont have any real argument.

    • SaltyIceteaMaker@lemmy.ml
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      2 days ago

      well they have 61 posts within a month, all of them being controversial topics/political opinions. no matter ypur political affiliation. this IS straight up bot behavior

      yet his comments sound pretty human, LLM? bot-human combination? maybe just a dude being paid? idk

        • SaltyIceteaMaker@lemmy.ml
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          1 day ago

          now, how do you know my world view? i never mentioned wether i agree or disagree, only that the shown behavior is what i would calssify as bot behavior

          • john_brown [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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            I don’t need to know your worldview because I recognize your defense mechanism. Nobody who accuses dissenting opinions of being bots ever has a well thought out worldview. You know as well as the rest of us, deep down, that you’re not identifying bots or paid users. You’re just incapable of creating a coherent argument against people with other politics, and this is your “out” to avoid coming to grips with it.

            • SaltyIceteaMaker@lemmy.ml
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              19 hours ago

              ohhhh are you sure you wanna say that? because based on tge “comrade” in your tag, and your description we seem to have exactly the same political opinions😬

              • john_brown [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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                10 hours ago

                You could agree with me completely and still be incapable of defending your worldview. I didn’t stutter, I said I don’t need to know your worldview and I meant it.

                • SaltyIceteaMaker@lemmy.ml
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                  8 hours ago

                  you are right, cause my worldview doesn’t matter. i see thibgs i attribute to bots, so i assume bot.

                  and what i wad referring to in my previous comment was you saying i couldn’t have a well thought out world view, which -assuming we have the same- would mean you don’t either. yet unlike you, i dont start defending everything that resembles my world view. i explained in previous comments why i thought it was a bot, yet you still assume that i just cant handle a diffrent opinion (which you have as flimsy of evidence as i have that they are a bot btw.)

    • ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org
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      2 days ago

      I would say they’re a bot,

      not a bad guess probably. just a week or two ago was when I noticed them posting frequently very suddenly, and before that I haven’t seen their name anywhere.

  • chaos@beehaw.org
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    23 hours ago

    ITT: people saying “the US and China both seem bad” and being told that they obviously just want to kiss America square on the lips because China has never done anything bad ever

    • jackeroni@lemmy.mlOP
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      2 days ago

      Only the right-wing neolibs of world and their ilk, I find the users of ml and hexbear to be quite nice

      • UltraGiGaGigantic@lemmy.ml
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        I was referencing nation states in general, not a subsection of the working class. Don’t get me wrong, rightoids are unbearable. I wish I could vacate this planet and leave them to play their shitty reindeer games with each other.

        These institutions (nation states) garner a level of devotion much like religion, regardless of their ideology. Tribalism.

        Nation states path to power is the capability to muster greater standing armies then other more decentralized ways of life. That is why the working class is so heavily divided through these imaginary lines on the globe.

        • KHROMATIKAL@lemmy.ml
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          2 days ago

          Downvotes are pro russian trolls

          Search engines are free. Russia criminalized gay, trans people and asexuals (the only country that specifically criminalizes asexuality iirc). You’re “defending” a fascist state lmao

      • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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        2 days ago

        Politics must be so easy when you just lazily strawman everyone who disagrees with you, before writing them off with an equally lazy adhominem.

        • Denjin@lemmings.world
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          2 days ago

          I haven’t strawman’d them, they literally say China, Russia, Iran and DPRK are great and the West is bad continually. There’s no nuance to their position. At no point have I seen any post or comment from the OP that says “you know what, there’s some good and bad on both sides and maybe we should strive to find the balance in our perspectives” (though I will admit, I haven’t specifically gone through their post and comment history to seek it out).

          It’s also not an ad hominem if I believe the person either doesn’t understand what they’re saying/doing or they’re intentionally saying/doing things because they’re themselves propagandised or being paid to say/do it.

          • BrainInABox@lemmy.ml
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            2 days ago

            I haven’t strawman’d them

            Oh? Please point to where they said “Putin, Xi and Kim are the perfect humans and there’s nothing wrong in any of their countries and they’re perfect utopias.” Because that sounds like a huge fucking strawman.

            It’s also not an ad hominem

            Refusing to engage with the substance of their point and dismissing them as “either a moron, brainwashed or a paid actor.” is basically the definition of an adhominem.

    • jackeroni@lemmy.mlOP
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      2 days ago

      Of course, someone has to post against the dominance that is western propaganda “media”

      • Dessalines@lemmy.ml
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        2 days ago

        Your comment got like 10 downvote from 2 year old no content accounts. The redditors are here on the fediverse to correct the record.

      • wizardbeard@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        2 days ago

        The solution to that isn’t to post even more blatantly state controlled media just with a different flavor of boot sole.

        Come on now.

        • ComradeSharkfucker@lemmy.ml
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          Nearly all media is state controlled. Even privately owned media companies because both the media and the state are just tools the owning class uses to maintain power. They share the same interests. There are some coalitions of reporters and journalists that have relative independence but even they must cooperate with the interests of the owning class or risk being shut out of key resources necessary for their reporting and therefore their income. The goal is to read reporting from all sources with the interests of the producers of that source in mind. You can read RT and get reliable information on some subjects just as you can read the kyivindependant and get reliable information on some subjects. Emphasis on some. It is unfortunately up to the reader to filter through bias, a skill that is suspisciously not taught well in our education.