Admins please remove if not appropriate. Anyone interested who can’t go, Zoom participation is apparently available. Also if you want to help someone else be able to afford to attend, you can donate on the registration form.
Admins please remove if not appropriate. Anyone interested who can’t go, Zoom participation is apparently available. Also if you want to help someone else be able to afford to attend, you can donate on the registration form.
I just can’t help myself, even though I’m not a member of the Greens, and would prefer anti-capitalists to come join the Socialists instead, here’s the link that I searched for ya haha
https://my.greens.org.au/civicrm/event/register?id=26088
I wanted to love the socialists party but every event I just got hit by SocAlt members regurgitating their talking points and I realised the party is not full of my kind of Socialists.
I have nothing against the party or SocAlt but I just don’t fit the niche they are trying to steer the party in. I would still be very happy to see them get someone elected and push Australian politics in the general right direction though.
It is an exciting time for The Greens under Shoebridge and I am very interested to see how the direction of the party goes from here. He is already backing some much more exciting policy than I have seen from The Greens for a while.
@CagedDingo @MisterFrog I agree with your points there (and not just the critical ones). Well put. I was a witness to the founding of Vic Socialists, it was dirty, I (and a lot of others) left the Socialist Alliance over their part in it. And besides, I’ve always been cold on the evangelical fervour typical of SAlt. But you know, I wouldn’t have dreamed of joining the Greens party 10 or 15 years ago, and yet here I am. Parties change under the pressure of events (as do we) and the future is unwritten. I hope The Socialists do well and make a difference.
@bencourtice @CagedDingo @MisterFrog and the future is unwritten . . . well said
Yeah I hope the Greens do well at expense of the major parties, since I want to see politics move leftward. Just that I don’t like how top-down the party is in structure (regarding how leadership is decided, and how policy is formed), and that they’re not anti-capitalists.
May I ask what direction that is, by the way? I’m not a Socialist Alternative member, and they don’t even represent a majority of the membership, it’s just they’re the most dedicated members and hence show up more than the average member.
From what I can tell, they’re a revolutionary organisation, making the argument that reforming our way to socialism is impossible, and I agree with them on that.
Even if we have socialists (be that from Aus Socialists, the Greens if they go further left, or whoever) representing more than 50% of Parliament, does anyone seriously believe the ruling class is going to let us usher in socialism?
They couped Gough Whitlam for far less.
In the average Australian Socialist (the party, I can’t speak for “socialists” who are part of micro-parties) believes that the only way we can get to socialism is by mass democratic action, that is, building a movement, making the arguments to everyone and winning enough people over that the current system needs to be replaced. And then going and doing that outside of Parliament (i.e. a revolution), so that we can set up more democratic bodies, and decentralise decision making.
Contesting parliamentary elections is just one way we get our message out.
I think Johnny Harris’ (certainly not a socialist) video on democracy actually sums things up fairly well. The ruling class only let us make decisions that not affect the status quo: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O7LvhSQ5Te4
Hey, thanks or bringing up the SocAlt because I knew nothing about them and so had a bit of a look. They don’t seem to have a lot of fans. eh.
Anyway, I hope they are genuine socialists and not ‘packaged socialists’ because they’re no different, imv, than the Alt Right pouring out formulaic viewpoints that don’t actually help and support people.
I’m not a member of SAlt, but the people I’ve met are very dedicated and very well-read. It’s not like they’re just regurgitating something they’ve been told to say.
I think they sometimes can come across a bit stronger than people are used to, mostly out of a genuine desire to win you to a socialist point of view.
I’ve personally had no reason to dislike them, and all of the criticism I’ve seen so far hasn’t really made sense to me (from a socialist perspective, I obviously know why One Nation voters wouldn’t like them, lol)
I’m just not part of them because the requirements (mostly regarding time commitment and membership dues) from members is a bit more than I’m currently willing to do.
I’m happy in VS (Victorian Socialists) and happy to have them around in VS.
@MisterFrog
I lost any sympathy for SAlt because of their habit of repeatedly turning up to rallies like the Invasion Day march, where the organisers have specifically asked political organisations not to do any campaigning, and using them as an opportunity to flog newspapers and recruit members.
But you know, if being lectured about Trotskyism by a Melbourne Uni student who is larping as a dangerous radical before going off to work for daddy’s law firm is your thing, get amongst it.
@arbilp3
This is a little rude to me to be honest.
I’m not a member of SAlt, and just because you don’t like them, doesn’t mean this is remotely close to the truth: “if being lectured about Trotskyism by a Melbourne Uni student who is larping as a dangerous radical before going off to work for daddy’s law firm is your thing”
Yeah that sounds kinda shitty if true, can agree, though I couldn’t verify this was specifically asked based on event information posted on various websites by the organisers.
Look, you don’t have to like SAlt, but I kinda think it’s a bit over the top to extend that dislike to people part of Victorian Socialists simply by association.
@MisterFrog
VicSoc is not SAlt. My criticism is of Socialist Alternative, and if you thought it was directed at you then that’s not what I intended.
I’m impressed by how organised and active VicSoc seem to be at the moment. They’re running a great campaign in Brunswick, I hope they do well. I’m looking forward to living somewhere where the two party preferred count is between the Greens and VicSoc.
Ah righto, misunderstanding ony part. Appreciate the clarification
I’m not much of a joiner but I have joined The Greens because it seems to be the only Left political voice in parliament and I can’t see a revolution happening quite yet.
There was a socialist group in the area I used to live in Sydney but they seemed to be so formulaic in their communication, it sounded (to me) like they were in the early twentieth century. If you can’t connect on a human level then spouting in-group speak is not going to attract people. (You are nothing like that btw.)
I’m glad you have found a group you are happy to be with. The Left often gets caught up in in-fighting and we need to support genuine work.
Yeah fair enough, I’m glad to see all left groups growing. Good on ya for getting involved.
And as always I’m of the opinion groups should work together on topics where they agree, and I do see that happening on a number of occasions at protests/rallies that the Socialists and the Greens go to, which I think is great!
Yeah this is annoying. I agree with you, personally I think (and is the main focus of VS policy) we’re most effective in our communication when we focus on the problems of today, and identify why they are (i.e. housing crisis, cost of living, etc is primarily so bad because of all the profit seeking and that’s a feature of capitalism).
There are all sorts of people identifying as socialist out there. There’s even some people (luckily not visibly part of our party) who think China is socialist and to be emulated, which most in VS think is absurd.
“Left infighting” exists because “the Left” really is not a monolith haha, I really can’t reconcile with people who think that Mao and Stalin were top blokes lol. We’ll just show up to the same actions from time to time where our goals align
All the best with your launch mate :)
Thanks MF 🐸🩷
Believe it or not. When I posted this up the link went straight to the rego details, but then I saw that no image was coming up so print-screened it. Once I did that and posted it I forgot that it deletes the original link. Again, thank you. I’ll put it in the text.