A horrifying image shows the injuries of a hiker who walked 10 miles with a trekking pole through his body instead of paying for a helicopter evacuation.
  • switcheroo@lemmy.worldEnglish
    5·
    2 days ago

    Welcome to the US.

    If I’m conscious, no matter what happens, I will always have the thought: can I make it to the hospital on my own.

    Disgusting dystopian hellhole…

  • FlyingCircus@lemmy.world
    6·
    2 days ago

    This article reads like health insurance propaganda. It’s all about how selfless this guy is, and never talks about how insane it is that he had to risk death to avoid crippling medical debt.

  • Dearth@lemmy.world
    5·
    2 days ago

    Ive heard of helicopter rescue insurance in the United states. Last i looked into it (15 years ago) it was around $50 per year. Considering the fact that ive heard more than one story of people getting themselves out of the backcountry with terrible injuries, i think it would be a good investment for anyone navigating privatized healthcare while enjoying outdoor sports.

  • greedytacothief@lemmy.dbzer0.comEnglish
    9·
    3 days ago

    Where I am in New York it’s a little weird. There’s one private helicopter that costs a lot for rescue and a police helicopter that’s free. Also if it’s just the rangers that come up to save you, that’s also free. But the ambulance ride will bankrupt you.

    I’ve even heard of a guy who will hike up a mountain, call 911 saying he’s dehydrated and will wait for the rangers to carry him down, only to be fine at the bottom. (He’s done it twice)

  • HubertManne@piefed.socialEnglish
    451·
    3 days ago

    He was a nurse to. Which just makes him more aware of how things like that can just ruin a person in the us. Remember when that hospital took away healthcare benefits from its janitorial staff. That to me is peak us explanations. A hospital can’t afford to give its staff health insurance. ugh.

  • benjirenji@slrpnk.net
    611·
    4 days ago

    In Switzerland I pay 40CHF (~49USD) yearly to get a free helicopter evacuation in case of an accident. Never needed it, but I know people that have. Absolutely worth it. While it’s “just hiking” in most cases, being out in nature in the middle of nowhere can get dangerous fast.

      • Kazumara@discuss.tchncs.de
        11·
        3 days ago

        Yeah it’s not great. Transport costs for emergencies are often only covered 50% in Switzerland. We do have the second most costly system after the US, and it’s for the same reason imho, private insurers. There are some more guardrails here than in the US, so it’s not completely horrible, but there are lots of better systems around Europe.

        Regarding helicopter rescue specifically, that’s kind of a funny case. In Switzerland the first helicopter rescue organization was founded as a non-profit foundation called Rega, and it continues to operate that way.

        For patrons the Rega eats the cost of a rescue that no insurance covers. If you are not a patron and get rescued then the cost of the rescue that isn’t covered falls to you. So in effect a Rega patronage also acts as a sort of gap-insurance.

        Around 40% of the population are registered patrons of the Rega foundation. The cost for that is what benjirenji was actually referring to.

      • Obi@sopuli.xyz
        123·
        3 days ago

        In Switzerland they deal with an endless line of brain-dead tourists that put themselves into stupid situations where helicopter evacuation is the only option, so I can kinda understand that they’d put some stuff in place to prevent people from abusing that.

        • Doc_Crankenstein@slrpnk.netEnglish
          52·
          3 days ago

          Tourists are human and all humans deserve free and ready access to healthcare or other emergency services, regardless of if they were born within the arbitrary bounds of your nation or otherwise.

          There is no understanding that justifies requiring payment for emergency services behind a paywall.

          • Obi@sopuli.xyz
            2·
            3 days ago

            The relevant part isn’t that they’re tourists, it’s that they willingly put themselves in dangerous situations they aren’t prepared for that require dangerous and expensive evacuations by the bucket-load. High mountain evacuations are a very different beast from regular healthcare service. They need the guardrails, I think it’s totally fair to pay your 40 bucks as insurance if you’re going to go into these places.

              • Obi@sopuli.xyz
                23·
                3 days ago

                Ok then they’ll close access to the mountains… Is that better? If it was your son dying from having to rescue some idiot who went up there with no prep during a snowstorm I wonder if you’d think the same.

                • Doc_Crankenstein@slrpnk.netEnglish
                  32·
                  2 days ago

                  Or they could just not and provide the service, since that is always an option.

                  Nah, I’d be damn proud of them for risking their life to save another in need, not irrationally blame the one who had the need, regardless of why they needed it, because I’m not some jaded, misanthropic twit who just assumes the worst in everyone.

                  so you can pack up your little strawman and fuck all the way off with it.

    • Bixcut@lemmy.world
      1·
      2 days ago

      2 different companies cover the area I live in. I pay the annual fee for both. Just in case I have an accident while sitting at my computer that requires an air lift.

    • ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net
      7·
      3 days ago

      I once went on a trip to Atacama and as a responsible person got insurgence that specifically covered rescue above 5000m. When I got there locals told me that there are actually no rescue teams there or anything.

      • Gordon Calhoun@lemmy.world
        7·
        3 days ago

        I once went on a trip to Atacama and as a responsible person got insurgence that specifically covered rescue above 5000m. When I got there locals told me that there are actually no rescue teams there or anything.

        Not sure i would trust insurgents with that task…

        • ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de
          3·
          3 days ago

          That’s like arguing a house costs $1500 because that’s what my yearly insurance is.

          You’re almost definitely not going to need to get that helicopter ride.

          • Thorry@feddit.org
            112·
            3 days ago

            If you want to be pedantic, at least be extra pedantic about it.

            It’s all about the meaning of the word get. They aren’t literally getting a free ride, since the fee is not for the ride. They pay the fee to be eligible for the free ride. So they are actually paying to be on the list, not to use the service.

            But if you want to go one level deeper, in a world running on a capitalist system, nothing can ever be truly free. In the end everything is funded from the economy and we all contribute to the economy in some way.

  • Pyr@lemmy.ca
    121·
    3 days ago

    That’s stupid, emergency services should not come at a cost. If it were a hiker needing to be rescued because they were stupid and didn’t prepare properly charge them. If it’s an unforseen emergency than provide it as a service.

    I’m surprised the cops don’t charge money for showing up to calls, or the firefighters. Why is the medical field so different?

        • Bilb!@lemmy.mlEnglish
          1·
          2 days ago

          From what I can tell, in Germany it’s largely a “hope your medical insurance covers it” situation. Apparently, around 99.9% of people in Germany have health insurance in some form.

          • uniquethrowagay@feddit.org
            1·
            2 days ago

            Only edge cases where people acted exceptionally recklessly wouldn’t fully be covered by insurance, as far as my experience goes.

            • TimmyDeanSausage @lemmy.world
              1·
              2 days ago

              It’s very different here. I was paying $400+ a month for united Healthcare and they denied everything. Couldn’t see specialists, every treatment denied. They wouldn’t even give me a 90 count supply of my meds. Only 30 counts.

              I’ve had health issues that have gone unresolved for years… Years! I work constantly and get almost nothing in return.

  • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexusEnglish
    416·
    4 days ago

    Ok, the headline leaves out the little detail that the hiker is a trained nurse, which was able to self-assess that if he wasn’t dying already, that he has been fucking lucky with the path through the body.

    But in every other civilized country they wouldn’t have to be able to self-assess something like that, they would call emergency services instead of gambling with the possibility that some nicked artery or a wounded organ gets worse because of the trek - especially the path out on the lower back just screams “kidney injury” or “danger to the blood supply of that kidney”.

    • ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de
      23·
      3 days ago

      I know a lot of nurses and I’ve been an EMT for getting close to 20 years.

      The self assessment was “I can breathe. I can walk. I can not afford a $30,000 helicopter ride”

      • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexusEnglish
        3·
        3 days ago

        Yeah, i figured as much. Long term damage did not enter the calculation when faced with financial annihilation.

    • jaybone@lemmy.zipEnglish
      6·
      3 days ago

      It’s interesting they mention paying for a helicopter. Not sure how that works both in the US and in other “civilized” countries.

      But I suppose tax paying people need to decide on how to deploy emergency services. One could say if you take on the risk of climbing a 12,000 foot mountain, then you should be responsible for paying for your rescue. (Btw the article doesn’t directly quote him as saying he didn’t want to pay. Also there are other factors like you are then endangering the lives of the rescuers and possibly other hikers by bringing in a helicopter in such terrain.) Of course then there are people who would say if society doesn’t cover the cost of such a rescue, then only the wealthy will be able to “go on such adventures” or “do stupid shit” depending on your take on the activity. (See for example climbing Mt Everest.)

      So it was an interesting choice of the author to put that “pay for” phrase in there. Meanwhile people who get cancer through no fault of their own also cannot get treatment they can’t afford.

      But anyway yeah that dude is lucky he is a nurse.

      • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexusEnglish
        12·
        3 days ago

        I live in Austria, we have our fair share of mountains. If it is a medical emergency like in this case, you won’t get a bill. If you get surprised by a sudden weather swing that wasn’t forseeable, you won’t get a bill. If you are a stupid tourist wearing flipflops and getting lost in the dark on the mountaintop, you will have to pay. So personal responsibility is still there, but only as far as it could be expected from someone trekking onto a mountain.

    • OfCourseNot@fedia.io
      81·
      4 days ago

      This is, in fact, what every country (civilised or not, I’m not gonna be the one handing out civilisation membership cards) does in these cases.

    • MissJinx@lemmy.world
      32·
      4 days ago

      There are no nurses in “other civilized countries”? What about the uncivilized? Do they?

      • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexusEnglish
        62·
        4 days ago

        Your functional analphabetism is no concern of mine, but i will take my sentence apart for you:

        “But in every other civilized country they <dont have to be a nurse at all>, <because the sane reaction is calling for emergency services>”

        I hope this helps.

        • Apepollo11@lemmy.world
          51·
          3 days ago

          I don’t think that’s the part of the sentence that’s the issue - I read it the same way as the previous poster, and realise what the problem is. You said:

          But in every other civilized country they wouldn’t have to be able to self-assess something like that

          On first read, it sounded like you’re saying “they wouldn’t have been able to self-assess something like that”, whereas you’re actually saying “they wouldn’t have needed to self-assess something like that”.

          Please remember that this is an internet where seemingly half of the Americans we meet are 100% convinced that the US is the only place in the world with cars, electricity, running water, etc. The assertion that the US is the only country with nurses capable of self-assessing injuries totally seems like something that someone would post.

          • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexusEnglish
            1·
            3 days ago

            There is quite the distinction between “wouldn’t have to be able” (as in “it would not be necessary”) and “wouldn’t have been able” (as in “incapable of”) if you have any sense of grammar. I do make my fair amount of mistakes, as anyone does, and i am no grammar nazi at all, but i have to point out if someones ability to understand what i am saying seems to be lacking.

            Like i said, functional analphabetism (which the US suffers the most of in comparison to other developed countries) isn’t my problem, it’s the problem of the people who were neglected by their educational system and probably their parents.

            These people should be angry that no one thought it would be a positive thing if they could understand clearly what was said. But it’s not me who they should direct their snark and anger towards. They should burn down the houses of the (mainly republican) politicians who have been dismantling the US education system für the last 60 years and demand better. That’s not an action i can take for them to improve their situation. Don’t shoot the messenger.

              • Wildmimic@anarchist.nexusEnglish
                1·
                2 days ago

                Sorry, humor translates badly on the internet, same as sarcasm 🤷. And that i instantly thought that you weren’t able to understand me because of educational issues makes it even worse… because the probabilities were in my favor. I wish it weren’t so, but functional analphabetism is RAMPANT in the US, and that was before the Trump admin started demolishing everything that could be interpreted as intellectual.

                I am personally happy for you that this situation is not something that hurts you directly, but in my (limited) experience it makes a lot of sense to provide people with enough information to be angry about the status quo, because the might never arrive at it if they were left on their own.

                • About 70% of adults in the U.S. prison system read at or below the fourth-grade level, according to the 2003 National Adult Literacy Survey, noting that a “link between academic failure and delinquency, violence and crime is welded to reading failure.”[9]
                • 85% of US juvenile inmates are functionally illiterate.[8]
                • 43% of adults at the lowest level of literacy lived below the poverty line, as opposed to 4% of those with the highest levels of literacy.[8]
                • MissJinx@lemmy.world
                  1·
                  2 days ago

                  love, I’m not american. English is not even my first language, and different from americans I can speak more than 1 language (5 in total).

                  Before you tell me to “go back to my country”, I also don’tt live in the US thank god

            • Apepollo11@lemmy.world
              3·
              3 days ago

              My friend, nobody is blaming you - it’s a failing of the language. I was just explaining where the misunderstanding likely occurred.

  • Crashumbc@lemmy.worldEnglish
    121·
    3 days ago

    I’m all for universal health care. But at the same time being outdoors/hiking/fishing most of my life.

    Some of the insanely stupid shit I’ve seen people do in the middle of fucking no where…

    I mean accidents happen, but if you’re that idiot that ignored four warnings and got gored trying to pet a bison, part of me thinks you SHOULD have to pay for that helicopter ride

    • sunstoned@lemmus.orgEnglish
      22·
      3 days ago

      There should be consequences, sure, but life long financial ruin isn’t exactly a punishment that fits the crime here.

      • Aeao@lemmy.world
        1·
        2 days ago

        They have to cut off their own finger and hand it to the rescue crew. After the filth time the take a hand. Then just keep going until the decide to stop being stupid.