Isn’t it the case that one of the better signs of ADHD is ADHD medication is not addictive for you? That is what I recall hearing back in the 1990s when ADHD was first becoming a thing we treated.
Addiction can take many forms, one of which is based around withdraw. With regular use, it sometimes becomes impossible to get up in the morning without it. But this is different than how it seems to be for neurotypical people (as I’m sure many of us have seen it when sharing our meds in our youth)
For neurotypical people, amphetamines make them slightly manic, not just just energized but also euphoric. With ADHD, instead it’s more like gaining clarity, the task that looks like a mountain is reduced just to the path through it. It’s like dropping weight, all the imaginary baggage required for a thing is just gone, and you can just do it
Give most people strong stimulants and ask them to meditate and they’ll grind their teeth and twitch with unrealized energy. Give one to someone with adhd, and they’ll find it easier to be still than they ever have
Dopamine is a component in habit-forming behaviors, drugs that elevate dopamine levels therefore may be habit-forming. People with ADHD have a form of dopamine deprivation or pathway insufficiency, so a drug that increases dopamine levels just makes them feel normal (when used as directed).
I’m in that finding out phase at the moment. Based on a conversation with my GP she prescribed 5mg extended release Adderall while I’m waiting on my neurologist testing next month. This dose doesn’t “hit me” or make me feel feel necessarily different, but I’ve been shocked at moments where I’ve completed something I’ve started and I don’t have the overwhelming urge to take a nap and check out for the rest of the day because I have no more resources to function with!
I’m terrible with remembering vitamins or supplements, so when I go to bed at night I have an insulated cup full of ice and water next to my bed that I rest my glasses on. I balance the pill bottle on top of my glasses. When I wake up I reach for my glasses and end up with a pill bottle in my hand so I take it before I get out of bed. I’m blind without my glasses, so so far so good.
@bluGill@ickplant It is. ADHD people forget to take the drug because they need it but are not addicted. I know that doesn’t happen to people that smoke. They don’t accidentally forget to smoke. That is addiction at work.
Yes, essentially, most stimulants don’t create the same effect in people with ADHD as they do with neurotypical people. Or at the very least it takes a significantly higher dosage. So, the psychological addiction to stimulants rarely forms.
Now, some stimulants also have a physically addictive property as well as the psychological addiction. That may or may not be as reduced in people with ADHD, but at least for me, I do get headaches when I don’t have caffeine for a couple of days, but I still forget to have it sometimes because the psychological addiction isn’t there I guess. But I have no such effects from forgetting to take Adderall. Not sure if Adderall is less physically addictive in general than caffeine or if it’s just me. I use a combination of Adderall and caffeine to normalize myself. They have different effects that together work well for me.
As an aside anecdote, I also tried some illicit stimulant drugs when I was younger, before I knew I had ADHD and I never got the significant stimulant effects or got addicted. Though in the moment I did feel the craving for more.
Not sure what all that means, but there are definitely significant differences in how stimulants affect people with ADHD including addictive responses.
Anyway, the reason ADHD meds are regulated so heavily is due to the flawed logic in drug-war-centered policy that prioritizes fighting illicit use despite valid medical use. But as anyone who has ever had kids knows, telling people they can’t do something without giving them the knowledge and freedom to decide for themselves, just encourages them to do it even more. Not even accounting for the fact that many illicit drug users are actually self medicating and better healthcare systems tend to reduce illicit use more than severe punishments. But at least in the US, the private prison system greatly profits from the drug war and funds a lot of politicians with that money, so it’s unlikely to change.
This is nonsense. I don’t know why people keep saying this. I’ve been medicated for 30 years and you definitely get a euphoria boost when the meds kick in, and you definitely get withdraws on days you don’t take them. They aren’t bad or anything. Just feeling a bit tired and crazy hungry, but the idea that the pills don’t have the standard upper effects on people with adhd is just wrong.
Everyone is different. It’s a mixture of several disorders afterall. For me this is how it works. Same with my girlfriend who is also ADHD like me.
With Adderall, no euphoric upper effect from stimulants unless we use a very high dose. No physical withdrawal symptoms, just back to how we are unmedicated, e.g. easy to get mentally exhausted from anything mentally taxing, difficulty paying attention to a single task, reduced executive function, etc. But it’s not something that happens immediately. It’s once the tasks become overwhelming that we notice we didn’t take our meds. There is not really an immediate sign assuming I had a good night’s rest and I’m not already burnt out.
Caffeine on the other hand has more of a physical withdrawal for me if I don’t have it. And, especially if I’m also on Adderall, and I really load up on it, I do sometimes get that high, “tweaker” feeling. And if I have too much too late in the day, it can keep me from sleeping. (Though, some people with ADHD I know actually use caffeine to fall asleep since it helps them avoid the mind wandering so much.) Besides the same issues as above, I do get headaches late the first day and if I had been overdoing it for several days and stop, cold turkey, I can get migraines around the second or third day.
But I never have a psychological desire to have the medication or caffeine nagging at me like true addiction. I do get what that feels like such as from not having an orgasm for a while like if I travel and don’t bring a vibrator and really end up turned on from hormones. But I’ve never had anything like that from stimulants. Even crack cocaine that I tried a few times, many, many years ago.
Well, the studies out there disagree. While it varies from person to person, it is indeed true that people with ADHD are much less likely to experience euphoric affect when taking stimulant medication than Neurotypical people. If you take something like Adderall or Desoxyn, then the potential for euphoric affect is higher due to the faster dopaminergic release. So some people with ADHD can and do sometimes have that euphoric affect, but it’s definitely less common than for Neurotypicals.
As an adhder who does the coca, yes I’ve watched many people get strung out on the shit and snort a gram a night while I’m over here making a gram last a week+ because it helps me focus for work lol.
As far as I’m aware, it’s down to our homeostatic systems. They try and keep our bodies (and minds) in proper balance. When someone takes a drug, it pushes things out of “balance”. The homeostatic systems respond by adjusting other hormones etc to compensate. Eventually, you need more to get high, or some to feel normal. Not taking it, and the homeostatic systems overcompensate, leading to withdrawal symptoms.
With ADHD. The brain chemistry is out of balance already. The homeostatic systems try and respond, but can’t get far enough. We experience it as a need/craving for anything that produces dopamine.
When we take medication, it kicks out whole brain, with a focus on the executive functions. This takes the pressure off the homeostatic responses and let’s up operate in a calm state. The homeostatic systems also counter the various “side effects”. These are more minor than the main effect, and so have FAR less noticeable withdrawal symptoms. E.g. for me my appetite overshoots when I forget my meds. It’s technically withdrawal, but not really noticeable most of the time.
I have to take a break for about a week out of each month or two from my vyvanse prescription because eventually I completely lose my appetite - I can eat, but it tends to feel like I’m force-feeding myself. I usually also cut out caffeinated drinks during that week - try to give myself a stimulant break to reset.
Bro, you are straight-up talking out of your ass, and ,arguably, dangerously so. There are plenty of studies that show people with ADHD and substance use disorder are less prone to relapse when their ADHD is treated, the most effective treatment being stimulant medication. In fact, there are even studies showing that people with ADHD who were treated with stimulant medication as a kid are at significantly lower risk to develop substance use disorder later in life. While stimulant medication is definitely highly addictive for people without ADHD, studies consistently show that addiction risk is lowered when people with ADHD take stimulant medication. So while ‘technically’ true that it’s possible for people with ADHD to be addicted to stimulants, it’s flatly irresponsible to dismiss the mountain of research showing to benefits of stimulant medication in reducing addiction risk in people with ADHD.
I’m also going to make it a point to contend with your use of “physically addicted” in this context. There’s a huge difference between dependence and addiction and it’s very frequently obfuscated by the phrase “physically addicted” in the context of medication. Physiological dependence on stimulant medication for people with ADHD is common over longer periods of time, often requiring increased doses to maintain levels of effectiveness. It’s basically a cliche at this point for many neurotypical people to characterize this normal physiological response as “physical addiction”, regardless of frequently missed doses(who tf forgets to feed their addiction???), absence of euphoric effect at any point, association of the drug with symptomatic relief by the user, and a fucking prescription for an official diagnosis. Considering, once again, the mountain of evidence showing lowered risk of addiction in people with ADHD taking medication, the implied conflation of dependence and addiction with the phrase “physically addicted” is wildly irresponsible and ignorant.
If you don’t know what you’re talking about, shut the fuck up. You could be fucking with people’s lives considering the stigma and misinformation already out there. For a good amount of people, stimulant medication is what will be the thing that helps them finally beat addiction.
Jo didn’t say anything like that. He correctly said that stimulant medication is addictive because it is. It’s a managed addiction. Like, if I don’t take my meds for a few days I don’t get shakes or tremors or night sweats or anything. I just get hungry and sleepy. That’s withdraw. That’s chemical dependency. It’s mild but it’s 100% fact. This is all very well documented in the medication guidance as well. Euphoria, weight loss and insomnia when starting. Weight gain, anxiety and agitation when stopping.
First, chill the fuck out. Second, I am not, in anyway, discouraging the use of stimulants for the treatment of ADHD. Let me.make this part VERY clear. ADHD medication can and is often life altering for those affected and should be absolutely considered, under medical supervision. Third, I have read a lot of the studies and I am not disagreeing with the fact that the medication is safe (still urge medical supervision).
If you cool your jets you’d realize that what I am speaking of SPECIFICALLY, is the implication in the original comment that people with ADHD are somehow immune to addiction to stimulants. Assuming immunity to addiction is dangerous and also not true. If you cannot differentiate between the two very different points, feel free to block me.
No one made that argument. The original question was asking if it’s a reliable confirmation of a correct diagnosis of ADHD if stimulant medication doesn’t seem to be addictive for the individual. The further implication was research done to demonstrate the low addiction risk of people with ADHD with stimulant medication. There was no attempt at specified language that would necessitate an implication that they believed people with ADHD are “immune”(in the popular use) to stimulant addiction. Maybe their use of language was inexact, but communication is a two-way street and it’s important to not assume necessity where it isn’t explicitly specified. A response of “No.” to the intent of the original question is irresponsibly incorrect.
Even if their intent was indeed to specifically say people with ADHD are immune to stimulant addiction, while the correct first part of a response would be to say that definitely isn’t the case, it still implies some interaction with the studies showing the direct benefits of stimulant medication for people with ADHD struggling with addiction. Leaving the response at a negative would be factually correct, but still irresponsible to leave out the referred studies because the implication would be that it’s just some random made-up bullshit, increasing stigma, seeding skepticism of the actual studies, and just generally being unhelpful. It’s a topical discussion, so the appropriate thing is to actually address the topic at hand.
Also, starting off your comment with “chill the fuck out” and ending it with “feel free to block me.” is hilarious. I’m sorry, I’m not sure how to phrase that without it seeming like I’m mocking you, I just genuinely find it funny.
That’s the one I’m on. It works in that I can concentrate, but it does somewhat elevate my heart rate. Gave my friend headaches. What does it do to you?
I’m on dexmethylphenidate. It’s a gods send at therapeutic dosage, but it makes me craah and burn if I take too much. Once or twice taught me that lesson.
Okay don’t generalize. As a self medicated ADHD person I’ve picked up stimulants many times and dropped them many times with ease. Just because Neurotrypicals can’t handle their shit doesn’t mean we can’t.
What the parent comment is saying is true. I’m diagnosed and medicated for ADHD but struggled with a bad amphetamine addiction in my late teens. I’ve been clean for nearly a decade now but we don’t have some sort of superpower that frees us from from addiction, especially not from the physical aspects of it that OP specifically referred to. Do you think you wouldn’t get a week of headaches when quitting a pot of coffee a day?
Your comment is insulting, ignorant and genuinely upsetting as someone who went through absolute hell
I have tried so many stimulants and been on a chunky dose of methamphetamine and have at zero points in time felt any kind of urge to use stimulants for anything other than necessity or because of social situations. Literally physical or mental urges. I frequently forget to take my meds because there is zero withdrawal. A big part is that I don’t get high from stimulants, they slow my thoughts down. Cocaine as always calming for me so it was like trading places!
Since it is a spectrum I’m certain this isn’t true for everyone, but it really is a thing for a lot of us because we don’t react to stimulants like the average person.
I’m sorry but your personal life experience doesn’t overrule facts. Some people are more prone to addiction than others. Others are more resistant to certain chemicals, but nobody is fully immune regardless of amount and duration.
Anecdotes are insufficient to support something like this, sure. However, their experience does indeed match what the studies show. People with ADHD statistically have a lower risk of addiction when treated with stimulant medication. People with ADHD have very low risk of addiction to stimulant medication. This is what the studies show.
To understand drug response as varied levels of resistance is indeed the generally accepted characterization, however, I must once again contend with the addition of “regardless of amount and duration”. Drug response is actually highly dependent on both “amount and duration”. Adherence is a big problem for prescribing doctors, especially concerning things like antibiotics. There are plenty of people who discontinue an antibiotic schedule whenever they “feel better”, greatly increasing the risk of drug-resistant disease. The patient could then have no response upon a repeat infection, now being “fully immune” to the drug. It’s possible to take low enough doses of a drug/medication that the body metabolizes it before there could be any effect. It’s possible that someone’s genetic makeup means a common medication can have no effect. Especially with things like addiction, “amount and duration” can easily be the deciding factor. To disregard dosage and duration of usage for someone with increased risk for addiction is wildly irresponsible. To emphasize that increased addiction risk can make it to where the risk of abuse is elevated even for lower “normal” doses regardless of effect highlights a strong justification for abstinence altogether.
In any case, you’re very irresponsibly talking out of your ass.
People with ADHD statistically have a lower risk of addiction when treated with stimulant medication. People with ADHD have very low risk of addiction to stimulant medication. This is what the studies show.
100% but the qualifier is extremely important. You can get as verbose as you want, and you can continue to accuse me of “talking out my ass” all the while acknowledging my original point but what you are doing is dangerous. Insinuating that ADHD folk have a super power that makes them immune to addiction to stimulants is dangerous and irresponsible. I am politely asking you to reconsider your words and actions. Trying to win some sort of internet argument through attacks, pedantry, and ignoring the basic message being given is wrong. I am simply urging caution and medical supervision when on medication. If that is something you disagree with, feel free to block me.
You are absolutely talking out of your ass. Look at the quoted text you have there. See how I’m typing out the words “lower risk” and “very low risk”? This does not “insinuate” an “immunity”(still assuming it’s the popular usage) to stimulant adiction and, in fact, would have a built-in premise that there is some risk. Otherwise it would say “no risk”. I really don’t understand why you’re strawmanning my position by directly contradicting specifically quoted from me. That’s pretty fucking weird.
On top of that, let’s talk the rhetoric then. Could you clarify on what you mean by attacks? I’m not convinced that I’ve been attacking you(as opposed to your arguments). Also, pedantry? Really? I chose my words carefully and you still immediately misinterpreted me. I’m trying to communicate clearly, why is your interpretation/reaction to that an implied accusation of arrogance? And like, you’re ending your comment with an implication that I would plausibly disagree with caution and medical supervision for someone on medication? What the hell? Seriously, what’s happening here?
What? There are plenty of studies showing the dramatic reduction of addictive behavior in people with ADHD when taking medication. In fact, a recent meta-study came to the conclusion that for those suffering an addiction disorder and ADHD have better outcomes of recovery when treating both the addiction and ADHD concurrently, including stimulant medication. They even specifically pointed out the reduction of addictive behavior when people with ADHD are medicated.
I mean, obviously the recommendations included caution with stimulant medication on a case-by-case basis. Stimulants probably shouldn’t be your first or even second line of treatment if someone’s addiction history includes meth or really any other drugs. Lower risk still necessitates the existence of risk for an addictive substance.
Either way, the literature still definitely flies in the face of much of the stigma out there about ADHD stimulants and the perceived “danger” being at a higher level for people with ADHD than someone who doesn’t. They’re even finding that if you were diagnosed and medicated as a kid, you’re at much lower risk of substance abuse when you get older versus someone who goes undiagnosed/unmedicated.
Isn’t it the case that one of the better signs of ADHD is ADHD medication is not addictive for you? That is what I recall hearing back in the 1990s when ADHD was first becoming a thing we treated.
I’d say it’s more like it doesn’t make us high
Addiction can take many forms, one of which is based around withdraw. With regular use, it sometimes becomes impossible to get up in the morning without it. But this is different than how it seems to be for neurotypical people (as I’m sure many of us have seen it when sharing our meds in our youth)
For neurotypical people, amphetamines make them slightly manic, not just just energized but also euphoric. With ADHD, instead it’s more like gaining clarity, the task that looks like a mountain is reduced just to the path through it. It’s like dropping weight, all the imaginary baggage required for a thing is just gone, and you can just do it
Give most people strong stimulants and ask them to meditate and they’ll grind their teeth and twitch with unrealized energy. Give one to someone with adhd, and they’ll find it easier to be still than they ever have
Dopamine is a component in habit-forming behaviors, drugs that elevate dopamine levels therefore may be habit-forming. People with ADHD have a form of dopamine deprivation or pathway insufficiency, so a drug that increases dopamine levels just makes them feel normal (when used as directed).
I’m in that finding out phase at the moment. Based on a conversation with my GP she prescribed 5mg extended release Adderall while I’m waiting on my neurologist testing next month. This dose doesn’t “hit me” or make me feel feel necessarily different, but I’ve been shocked at moments where I’ve completed something I’ve started and I don’t have the overwhelming urge to take a nap and check out for the rest of the day because I have no more resources to function with!
I’m terrible with remembering vitamins or supplements, so when I go to bed at night I have an insulated cup full of ice and water next to my bed that I rest my glasses on. I balance the pill bottle on top of my glasses. When I wake up I reach for my glasses and end up with a pill bottle in my hand so I take it before I get out of bed. I’m blind without my glasses, so so far so good.
Excellent routine hack, well done.
@bluGill @ickplant It is. ADHD people forget to take the drug because they need it but are not addicted. I know that doesn’t happen to people that smoke. They don’t accidentally forget to smoke. That is addiction at work.
No, that’s called dedication
Yes, essentially, most stimulants don’t create the same effect in people with ADHD as they do with neurotypical people. Or at the very least it takes a significantly higher dosage. So, the psychological addiction to stimulants rarely forms.
Now, some stimulants also have a physically addictive property as well as the psychological addiction. That may or may not be as reduced in people with ADHD, but at least for me, I do get headaches when I don’t have caffeine for a couple of days, but I still forget to have it sometimes because the psychological addiction isn’t there I guess. But I have no such effects from forgetting to take Adderall. Not sure if Adderall is less physically addictive in general than caffeine or if it’s just me. I use a combination of Adderall and caffeine to normalize myself. They have different effects that together work well for me.
As an aside anecdote, I also tried some illicit stimulant drugs when I was younger, before I knew I had ADHD and I never got the significant stimulant effects or got addicted. Though in the moment I did feel the craving for more.
Not sure what all that means, but there are definitely significant differences in how stimulants affect people with ADHD including addictive responses.
Anyway, the reason ADHD meds are regulated so heavily is due to the flawed logic in drug-war-centered policy that prioritizes fighting illicit use despite valid medical use. But as anyone who has ever had kids knows, telling people they can’t do something without giving them the knowledge and freedom to decide for themselves, just encourages them to do it even more. Not even accounting for the fact that many illicit drug users are actually self medicating and better healthcare systems tend to reduce illicit use more than severe punishments. But at least in the US, the private prison system greatly profits from the drug war and funds a lot of politicians with that money, so it’s unlikely to change.
This is nonsense. I don’t know why people keep saying this. I’ve been medicated for 30 years and you definitely get a euphoria boost when the meds kick in, and you definitely get withdraws on days you don’t take them. They aren’t bad or anything. Just feeling a bit tired and crazy hungry, but the idea that the pills don’t have the standard upper effects on people with adhd is just wrong.
Everyone is different. It’s a mixture of several disorders afterall. For me this is how it works. Same with my girlfriend who is also ADHD like me.
With Adderall, no euphoric upper effect from stimulants unless we use a very high dose. No physical withdrawal symptoms, just back to how we are unmedicated, e.g. easy to get mentally exhausted from anything mentally taxing, difficulty paying attention to a single task, reduced executive function, etc. But it’s not something that happens immediately. It’s once the tasks become overwhelming that we notice we didn’t take our meds. There is not really an immediate sign assuming I had a good night’s rest and I’m not already burnt out.
Caffeine on the other hand has more of a physical withdrawal for me if I don’t have it. And, especially if I’m also on Adderall, and I really load up on it, I do sometimes get that high, “tweaker” feeling. And if I have too much too late in the day, it can keep me from sleeping. (Though, some people with ADHD I know actually use caffeine to fall asleep since it helps them avoid the mind wandering so much.) Besides the same issues as above, I do get headaches late the first day and if I had been overdoing it for several days and stop, cold turkey, I can get migraines around the second or third day.
But I never have a psychological desire to have the medication or caffeine nagging at me like true addiction. I do get what that feels like such as from not having an orgasm for a while like if I travel and don’t bring a vibrator and really end up turned on from hormones. But I’ve never had anything like that from stimulants. Even crack cocaine that I tried a few times, many, many years ago.
Well, the studies out there disagree. While it varies from person to person, it is indeed true that people with ADHD are much less likely to experience euphoric affect when taking stimulant medication than Neurotypical people. If you take something like Adderall or Desoxyn, then the potential for euphoric affect is higher due to the faster dopaminergic release. So some people with ADHD can and do sometimes have that euphoric affect, but it’s definitely less common than for Neurotypicals.
Which studies?
As an adhder who does the coca, yes I’ve watched many people get strung out on the shit and snort a gram a night while I’m over here making a gram last a week+ because it helps me focus for work lol.
A gram of meth or dextro lasts some three months.
As far as I’m aware, it’s down to our homeostatic systems. They try and keep our bodies (and minds) in proper balance. When someone takes a drug, it pushes things out of “balance”. The homeostatic systems respond by adjusting other hormones etc to compensate. Eventually, you need more to get high, or some to feel normal. Not taking it, and the homeostatic systems overcompensate, leading to withdrawal symptoms.
With ADHD. The brain chemistry is out of balance already. The homeostatic systems try and respond, but can’t get far enough. We experience it as a need/craving for anything that produces dopamine.
When we take medication, it kicks out whole brain, with a focus on the executive functions. This takes the pressure off the homeostatic responses and let’s up operate in a calm state. The homeostatic systems also counter the various “side effects”. These are more minor than the main effect, and so have FAR less noticeable withdrawal symptoms. E.g. for me my appetite overshoots when I forget my meds. It’s technically withdrawal, but not really noticeable most of the time.
I have to take a break for about a week out of each month or two from my vyvanse prescription because eventually I completely lose my appetite - I can eat, but it tends to feel like I’m force-feeding myself. I usually also cut out caffeinated drinks during that week - try to give myself a stimulant break to reset.
No. With enough use, anybody can become physically addicted to anything.
Bro, you are straight-up talking out of your ass, and ,arguably, dangerously so. There are plenty of studies that show people with ADHD and substance use disorder are less prone to relapse when their ADHD is treated, the most effective treatment being stimulant medication. In fact, there are even studies showing that people with ADHD who were treated with stimulant medication as a kid are at significantly lower risk to develop substance use disorder later in life. While stimulant medication is definitely highly addictive for people without ADHD, studies consistently show that addiction risk is lowered when people with ADHD take stimulant medication. So while ‘technically’ true that it’s possible for people with ADHD to be addicted to stimulants, it’s flatly irresponsible to dismiss the mountain of research showing to benefits of stimulant medication in reducing addiction risk in people with ADHD.
I’m also going to make it a point to contend with your use of “physically addicted” in this context. There’s a huge difference between dependence and addiction and it’s very frequently obfuscated by the phrase “physically addicted” in the context of medication. Physiological dependence on stimulant medication for people with ADHD is common over longer periods of time, often requiring increased doses to maintain levels of effectiveness. It’s basically a cliche at this point for many neurotypical people to characterize this normal physiological response as “physical addiction”, regardless of frequently missed doses(who tf forgets to feed their addiction???), absence of euphoric effect at any point, association of the drug with symptomatic relief by the user, and a fucking prescription for an official diagnosis. Considering, once again, the mountain of evidence showing lowered risk of addiction in people with ADHD taking medication, the implied conflation of dependence and addiction with the phrase “physically addicted” is wildly irresponsible and ignorant.
If you don’t know what you’re talking about, shut the fuck up. You could be fucking with people’s lives considering the stigma and misinformation already out there. For a good amount of people, stimulant medication is what will be the thing that helps them finally beat addiction.
Jo didn’t say anything like that. He correctly said that stimulant medication is addictive because it is. It’s a managed addiction. Like, if I don’t take my meds for a few days I don’t get shakes or tremors or night sweats or anything. I just get hungry and sleepy. That’s withdraw. That’s chemical dependency. It’s mild but it’s 100% fact. This is all very well documented in the medication guidance as well. Euphoria, weight loss and insomnia when starting. Weight gain, anxiety and agitation when stopping.
First, chill the fuck out. Second, I am not, in anyway, discouraging the use of stimulants for the treatment of ADHD. Let me.make this part VERY clear. ADHD medication can and is often life altering for those affected and should be absolutely considered, under medical supervision. Third, I have read a lot of the studies and I am not disagreeing with the fact that the medication is safe (still urge medical supervision).
If you cool your jets you’d realize that what I am speaking of SPECIFICALLY, is the implication in the original comment that people with ADHD are somehow immune to addiction to stimulants. Assuming immunity to addiction is dangerous and also not true. If you cannot differentiate between the two very different points, feel free to block me.
No one made that argument. The original question was asking if it’s a reliable confirmation of a correct diagnosis of ADHD if stimulant medication doesn’t seem to be addictive for the individual. The further implication was research done to demonstrate the low addiction risk of people with ADHD with stimulant medication. There was no attempt at specified language that would necessitate an implication that they believed people with ADHD are “immune”(in the popular use) to stimulant addiction. Maybe their use of language was inexact, but communication is a two-way street and it’s important to not assume necessity where it isn’t explicitly specified. A response of “No.” to the intent of the original question is irresponsibly incorrect.
Even if their intent was indeed to specifically say people with ADHD are immune to stimulant addiction, while the correct first part of a response would be to say that definitely isn’t the case, it still implies some interaction with the studies showing the direct benefits of stimulant medication for people with ADHD struggling with addiction. Leaving the response at a negative would be factually correct, but still irresponsible to leave out the referred studies because the implication would be that it’s just some random made-up bullshit, increasing stigma, seeding skepticism of the actual studies, and just generally being unhelpful. It’s a topical discussion, so the appropriate thing is to actually address the topic at hand.
Also, starting off your comment with “chill the fuck out” and ending it with “feel free to block me.” is hilarious. I’m sorry, I’m not sure how to phrase that without it seeming like I’m mocking you, I just genuinely find it funny.
Lysdexamfetamine has too much nasty side effects to be fun to use. I use it rarely these days and then I split 70 mg into 4-5 doses.
That’s the one I’m on. It works in that I can concentrate, but it does somewhat elevate my heart rate. Gave my friend headaches. What does it do to you?
I’m on dexmethylphenidate. It’s a gods send at therapeutic dosage, but it makes me craah and burn if I take too much. Once or twice taught me that lesson.
I’m on Elvanse 30mg (Lisdex) and experience far less side effects than on Kinecteen (Methylphenidate). What was it like for you?
Okay don’t generalize. As a self medicated ADHD person I’ve picked up stimulants many times and dropped them many times with ease. Just because Neurotrypicals can’t handle their shit doesn’t mean we can’t.
What the parent comment is saying is true. I’m diagnosed and medicated for ADHD but struggled with a bad amphetamine addiction in my late teens. I’ve been clean for nearly a decade now but we don’t have some sort of superpower that frees us from from addiction, especially not from the physical aspects of it that OP specifically referred to. Do you think you wouldn’t get a week of headaches when quitting a pot of coffee a day?
Your comment is insulting, ignorant and genuinely upsetting as someone who went through absolute hell
I have tried so many stimulants and been on a chunky dose of methamphetamine and have at zero points in time felt any kind of urge to use stimulants for anything other than necessity or because of social situations. Literally physical or mental urges. I frequently forget to take my meds because there is zero withdrawal. A big part is that I don’t get high from stimulants, they slow my thoughts down. Cocaine as always calming for me so it was like trading places!
Since it is a spectrum I’m certain this isn’t true for everyone, but it really is a thing for a lot of us because we don’t react to stimulants like the average person.
I’m sorry but your personal life experience doesn’t overrule facts. Some people are more prone to addiction than others. Others are more resistant to certain chemicals, but nobody is fully immune regardless of amount and duration.
Anecdotes are insufficient to support something like this, sure. However, their experience does indeed match what the studies show. People with ADHD statistically have a lower risk of addiction when treated with stimulant medication. People with ADHD have very low risk of addiction to stimulant medication. This is what the studies show.
To understand drug response as varied levels of resistance is indeed the generally accepted characterization, however, I must once again contend with the addition of “regardless of amount and duration”. Drug response is actually highly dependent on both “amount and duration”. Adherence is a big problem for prescribing doctors, especially concerning things like antibiotics. There are plenty of people who discontinue an antibiotic schedule whenever they “feel better”, greatly increasing the risk of drug-resistant disease. The patient could then have no response upon a repeat infection, now being “fully immune” to the drug. It’s possible to take low enough doses of a drug/medication that the body metabolizes it before there could be any effect. It’s possible that someone’s genetic makeup means a common medication can have no effect. Especially with things like addiction, “amount and duration” can easily be the deciding factor. To disregard dosage and duration of usage for someone with increased risk for addiction is wildly irresponsible. To emphasize that increased addiction risk can make it to where the risk of abuse is elevated even for lower “normal” doses regardless of effect highlights a strong justification for abstinence altogether.
In any case, you’re very irresponsibly talking out of your ass.
100% but the qualifier is extremely important. You can get as verbose as you want, and you can continue to accuse me of “talking out my ass” all the while acknowledging my original point but what you are doing is dangerous. Insinuating that ADHD folk have a super power that makes them immune to addiction to stimulants is dangerous and irresponsible. I am politely asking you to reconsider your words and actions. Trying to win some sort of internet argument through attacks, pedantry, and ignoring the basic message being given is wrong. I am simply urging caution and medical supervision when on medication. If that is something you disagree with, feel free to block me.
You are absolutely talking out of your ass. Look at the quoted text you have there. See how I’m typing out the words “lower risk” and “very low risk”? This does not “insinuate” an “immunity”(still assuming it’s the popular usage) to stimulant adiction and, in fact, would have a built-in premise that there is some risk. Otherwise it would say “no risk”. I really don’t understand why you’re strawmanning my position by directly contradicting specifically quoted from me. That’s pretty fucking weird.
On top of that, let’s talk the rhetoric then. Could you clarify on what you mean by attacks? I’m not convinced that I’ve been attacking you(as opposed to your arguments). Also, pedantry? Really? I chose my words carefully and you still immediately misinterpreted me. I’m trying to communicate clearly, why is your interpretation/reaction to that an implied accusation of arrogance? And like, you’re ending your comment with an implication that I would plausibly disagree with caution and medical supervision for someone on medication? What the hell? Seriously, what’s happening here?
No, it’s still definitely addictive.
No, absolutely not. It’s more calming for us at pharmaceutical doses but that’s as far as the differences go
What? There are plenty of studies showing the dramatic reduction of addictive behavior in people with ADHD when taking medication. In fact, a recent meta-study came to the conclusion that for those suffering an addiction disorder and ADHD have better outcomes of recovery when treating both the addiction and ADHD concurrently, including stimulant medication. They even specifically pointed out the reduction of addictive behavior when people with ADHD are medicated.
I mean, obviously the recommendations included caution with stimulant medication on a case-by-case basis. Stimulants probably shouldn’t be your first or even second line of treatment if someone’s addiction history includes meth or really any other drugs. Lower risk still necessitates the existence of risk for an addictive substance.
Either way, the literature still definitely flies in the face of much of the stigma out there about ADHD stimulants and the perceived “danger” being at a higher level for people with ADHD than someone who doesn’t. They’re even finding that if you were diagnosed and medicated as a kid, you’re at much lower risk of substance abuse when you get older versus someone who goes undiagnosed/unmedicated.