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No, thanks.
We need to become more like Switzerland, not America. Direct democracy is the way, fire all unelected bureaucrats!
European Union is a much better name. So lets continue with the integration.
A few things to start:
- Commission should be directly elected by the people
- Parliament should take more responsibility and agency
- Parliament limitations should be lifted
- The council should gradually abdicate to the parliament
- Rigid rules for term limits for all elected EU officials for all institutions.
There are more and the road is long, but it is the right direction.
There are more and the road is long, but it is the right direction.
Doubt. Every attempt in history to centralise power in Europe has failed
A federation can have different levels of centralisation.
If it ends up with a president then it’s fucked. Single point of failure. A honeycomb structure of separate cells is much stronger and harder to take over, unlike a blob
Which attempts have been similar to the EU, and not just conquests? The closest I can think of is maybe the Habsburg dynasty, and I think we can agree that that had its own unique issues going on
Napoleon is the closest. A lot of the legal, judicial, and administrative civil code remains today.
In what fucking world was Napoleon’s attempt not a series of conquests?
European history all is just conquests
…so there has not been an attempt like the EU
The Hansa was something of a proto-EU.
There has. The European Communities and the EEC. Neither were attempts to create a federation like US, China or Russia…
Shouldn’t it be about time to form the united earth government and start reaching for the stars?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Earth
What’s your favourite?
I’m partial to the first one, just maybe mute the colours a bit:
I’m rather amused that there’s no land there. I’m sure there’s lots of reasons, like not being able to accurately put all landmass on there, there being arguments about why certain landmass is the focal point etc. but without any land it feels like the flag belongs to the oceans.
“Screw the landlubbers, they only cause problems anyway.”
Maybe by the time we have a world government there won’t be any land for people to get uppity about.
Yes, you are right. The EU has proven so far to be a good start, as it’s been a decent compromise between the great powers and the smaller countries. Getting that balance right is really hard, as the clusterfuck that is the UN proves.
Sure. And I mean country size wouldn’t even be an issue since we’re getting rid of the concept of countries. It’d be one earth. At the size of the earth. (And maybe a few separatist regions. 😅)
Why would a united Earth government get rid of countries? At the very least the borders make for convenient administrative zones to manage, but more than that I think it would be a monumental task to convince someone to consider themself an Earthican before being a member of their home country right off the bat. My understanding is that in past unification periods such as the early US or Italy it took a couple generations before someone would stop introducing themself as a Pennsylvanian and start introducing themself as an American.
I think world tensions/hostilities are too high for this to happen soon, but the way I foresee things is over the next many decades countries will form greater regional collections like the EU and then those regional groups will eventually form a council of 6-7 world powers that govern the planet as a whole. By that point maybe a person will refer to themself as a North American/Oceanian/etc. before calling themself Canadian or Indonesian, but it will be a slow process.
It sure will be.
I mean I’m from Central Europe. From ethnicity you probably can’t tell if someone is from my country or one of the neighbouring ones. And culture here in Germany also varies a lot. Do I feel more connected to someone in the south of my own country, than to someone a few kilometers away in a seperate country? I’m not sure. I don’t think so.
I mean saying things like “I’m from the USA” is nice and all. But I bet I’m going to ask a follow-up question immediately, because it’s such a vast and diverse country. So I think we might as well skip that step and directly go for the region?!
Dunno. The borders as we have them feel pretty arbitrary to me. And I really like the perks we got here with Europe and the Schengen Area. I can just go whereever I like, go shopping, a weekend trip and don’t need to care at all. No border controls, no worrying about how much alcohol and cigarettes I bring. I can pay in the same currency. Don’t need to worry about roaming cost on my smartphone… I think it’s awesome to not have borders.
Now we could as well get rid of the remaining stuff I do need to worry about when crossing borders. And I guess we could save a lot of money by getting rid of redundancy in administration. We could also pool money for military stuff and whatever. Which is probably going to be way more effective than everyone doing their own thing.
Also makes it easier for business. I mean as of now you need to abide by all kinds of different standards in different countries, get your product re-certified in imperial units to make some lunatics happy… That’s just wasted effort IMO.
I mean we could keep them as administrative zones. But we’d keep all the craziness baked in like towns with the border randomly traversing them. Someone’s living room being in a different administrative zone than the kitchen, enclaves, borders separating a cultural identity and mushing them together with other people based on politics and religion…
Jesus, it’s just way to say it needs to be a federation with more centralized government. No one is saying we should copy any specific ideas from US.
EU is falling behind because it’s unable to effectively work together for a common goal. Every country is constantly trying to protect its interests. We can’t stop Russians from entering EU because Italy and Spain is blocking it. We can’t ban gasoline cars because Germany is blocking it. More centralized government could solve those issues and let Europe compete with US and China.
I agree that it’s needed in this day and age, when we are faced with dictators.
However more centralized powers have historically led to war within Europe. Think about World war I and II, the Balkan wars, the Prussian wars, Napoleonic wars, the Seven years war, war of the Spanish succession and so on. This is the reason the EU is set up the way it is, all countries can influence decisions and there’s no dominant power overruling others. So it’s a bit of a double edged sword. Centralization helps to suppress cultural differences but doesn’t solve them.
Totally. I think huge progress was made in the last couple of decades but nationalism is still very strong in many countries and most people are still definitely not ready to put the good of Europe ahead of their national interests. Federation is needed but Europe is still not ready for it. Maybe in couple more decades but we’ll be lucky if EU survives for that long.
The USA is a model of excess, inequality and brutality. What kind of a lunatic uses that language or even role model? This is absolute fangirl language and doesn’t belong in civilised society.
For what it’s worth, there have been many United States that aren’t the US of America. Mexico’s full name is United Mexican States, and historically there have been USes of Brazil, Belgium, Colombia, Indonesia, Central America, and a few more
That said, I’m a native English speaker and the article is in Spanish. I don’t know if the original Spanish has an implication of “be like the USA” or if it’s just a way to say “Federalised EU”
Fair points. In the Anglosphere, there are groups called Volta using this exact same phrase. The even use imagery of racist genociders like Winston Churchill in their promotional material. They call themselves progressive. I wish I was joking.
No thanks.
We don’t want to build the setup for fascists to take over like in the US.
Why would a more integrated EU allow fascists to take over?
The fascists are anti EU and currently seem to be rapidly gaining power in national governments.
US fascists are also anti-US from one point of view. Their plan seems to be tearing it down from the inside. The same playbook would work in the EU.
I don’t know how to protect against fascism. But a United Europe would be a welcome addition to the world, I think.
1 central governement to take over instead of 27.
While true, i think it would be harder for something like the AfD to take over the EU central government then the german national government.
It might be harder for them to take over, but it would also be harder to remove them.
A few decades ago people used to think it would be hard for the fascists to take over the US, that they were a minority that wouldn’t gain popularity or a foothold in the different branches of government.
Obviously, we were wrong. And the rise of the far-right in EU countries shows the same can still happen there.
Having close ties with each other is good, helping each other is awesome, but centralizing power will only make it easier for it to be corrupted by fascism as climate change restricts global resources and the fascists are ready with their tired old scapegoats.
Maybe for AfD, but fascists will always find a way. The RN in France always comes first in the EU parliament elections despite them being nationalistic anti-EU nazis spin-offs. If there’s a place of power they’ll try to get there. A “United States of Europe” would be a whole lot of uncessary risk.
no it’s fucking not
Ventotene has just launched a new call to build the United States of Europe
Ventotene is once again at the heart of the debate on Europe’s future. On the Italian island that is a symbol of European federalism, the declaration “It is time to build the United States of Europe” was adopted and signed on 30 August 2026, promoted by the Third Jean Monnet Action Committee for the United States of Europe.
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