• ssillyssadass@lemmy.world
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    7 hours ago

    I don’t know if I trust the same government that proposed Chat Control in their opinions of things.

  • arin@lemmy.world
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    20 hours ago

    Nothing about chat control? They are so out of touch in this article

      • plyth@feddit.org
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        14 hours ago

        Some people argue that USSR collapsed because USA forced them into an arms race. If they only reacted then the West was in control and the threat to the West was only theoretical.

        The current war will lead to one side losing if they don’t escalate. If no side is willing to lose then this war must escalate at one point.

        • MaggiWuerze@feddit.org
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          11 hours ago

          The US didn’t force them into the arms race, russia itself was more than willing to invest that resources to project a sense of strength. They just couldn’t compete economically and ruined themselves with it

          • TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world
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            10 hours ago

            The Soviets and their satellite states produced more tanks than cars. So, that shows where the actual priorities of the USSR were.

              • TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world
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                6 hours ago

                I can’t find the source on Britannica, but it did mention that. I admit it could have been a misinformation or misunderstanding on my part about more tanks produced than cars.

                In the Wikipedia link you provided, it does mention that you have to wait for years to buy and own a car. That implies not many cars are actually available for many citizens despite the demand. There is a discussion about it on Quora https://www.quora.com/Why-did-the-Russians-during-Soviet-times-had-to-wait-10-years-for-a-car

                • kossa@feddit.org
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                  4 hours ago

                  That implies not many cars are actually available for many citizens despite the demand.

                  Well, don’t quote me on that, but I am pretty sure that the average soviet citizen couldn’t get a tank neither. In fact, it still was propably easier for them to get their hands on a car than on a tank.

                • plyth@feddit.org
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                  5 hours ago

                  The USSR was not a consumer paradise. But as long as public transport works, not having a car is acceptable. The important part is that we shouldn’t remember the USSR as a military dystopia as the initial relations could have suggested.

  • splendoruranium@infosec.pub
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    14 hours ago

    Can we stop with the self-fulfilling prophecies already? Fear-mongering has always been a necessary requirement for escalations of any kind 🤦

    • Melchior@feddit.org
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      12 hours ago

      Russia has started the largest war in Europe since WW2 and the Americans move very quickly from being allies to enemies. It is important to talk about that and act acordingly

      • splendoruranium@infosec.pub
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        11 hours ago

        Russia has started the largest war in Europe since WW2 and the Americans move very quickly from being allies to enemies. It is important to talk about that and act acordingly

        I agree with that, is there a contradiction here?

        • MaggiWuerze@feddit.org
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          11 hours ago

          It’s neither fear mongering nor a self fulfilling prophecy if you’re simply stating facts. It’s not the Danish PMs fault, that Russia mistakes itself for some kind of empire

          • splendoruranium@infosec.pub
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            10 hours ago

            It’s neither fear mongering nor a self fulfilling prophecy if you’re simply stating facts. It’s not the Danish PMs fault, that Russia mistakes itself for some kind of empire

            “I think we are in the most difficult and dangerous situation since the second world war.” is, by her own wording, decidedly not a fact. It’s pointless hyperbole and headline-hunting that compromises (arguably deliberately so) the reader’s perception of the world. A world that does not make rational decisions but decisions solely based on its perception of itself.
            And it was her active decision to make that statement.

            • MaggiWuerze@feddit.org
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              8 hours ago

              Sorry, did I miss the war the UdSSR forced on us in between 1944 and its end? Or Russia until 2014? When was the last time a European country was invaded by a foreign nuclear power? Or the last time a NATO member had their air space repeatedly violated by armed planes and drones?

              • splendoruranium@infosec.pub
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                7 hours ago

                Sorry, did I miss the war the UdSSR forced on us in between 1944 and its end? Or Russia until 2014? When was the last time a European country was invaded by a foreign nuclear power? Or the last time a NATO member had their air space repeatedly violated by armed planes and drones?

                I’m either misunderstanding you or the Danish PM. So I suppose, even though that would be her job, convince me: Why would the ongoing impotent flailing and blustering of an economically severely strained aggressor and their continued reasonable hybrid effort against your/my/one’s nation be “more dangerous” 2025 than in 2022, 2023 or 2024 and thus warrant a policy change compared to those years? Policy changes that, mind you, wouldn’t even more than tangentially affect nations that are currently facing actual attacks.

                • MaggiWuerze@feddit.org
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                  4 hours ago

                  Because this ‘flailing and blustering of an economically severely strained aggressor’ is now turned against us and reaching a level where NATO member have been forced into opening fire already.

        • Melchior@feddit.org
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          11 hours ago

          Given the situation a statement like the “most dangerous situation since WW2” stops being fear-mongering, but starts being at least somewhat reasonable.

          As for acting accordingly deterrence is a key part of that. Russia is going to see a lot of those actions as escalation. They certainly cried about every bit of aid send to Ukraine as being escalation. Putin and Trump certainly think somewhat alike. So being prepared against Putin is also going to help against Trump. The problem with that is that a war not waged due to heavy military spending, makes the military spending look stupid. The issue here is that we do not know how much was actually needed.

          • splendoruranium@infosec.pub
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            8 hours ago

            As for acting accordingly deterrence is a key part of that. Russia is going to see a lot of those actions as escalation. They certainly cried about every bit of aid send to Ukraine as being escalation. Putin and Trump certainly think somewhat alike. So being prepared against Putin is also going to help against Trump. The problem with that is that a war not waged due to heavy military spending, makes the military spending look stupid. The issue here is that we do not know how much was actually needed.

            That is the nature of a security dilemma. Riling up the general population to facilitate arms races is not a way out of it, is it?

            • Melchior@feddit.org
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              7 hours ago

              It is not. Russia is at war and has a war economy already. It can not have an arms race as well. The potential problem is that Russia might win the war against Ukraine and then use its military to fight the EU or that they believe they would lose due to EU support of Ukraine and therefore come to the conclusion that stopping that support could be achieved by attacking the EU.

              The way out of it is to send a lot of arms to Ukraine, while having a strong enough force in the EU to make sure that Russia does not do anything stupid.

              As for Trump that might happen, but the EU only needs enough to defend itself. So no carriers or large navy needed.

        • donalonzo@lemmy.world
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          11 hours ago

          So we should talk about the situation but we cannot state the severeness of the situation?

          • splendoruranium@infosec.pub
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            10 hours ago

            So we should talk about the situation but we cannot state the severeness of the situation?

            Is there any point in “stating” severeness of the situation, if you cannot measure it?
            There’s no scale here, Frederiksen didn’t sit down to develop some metric for situation severeness and then came to the conclusion “Oh, this rates at 1.2 Cuban Missile crises, better give the alarm”, she just blurted out a soundbite.

            • donalonzo@lemmy.world
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              9 hours ago

              I’m sorry, but what?

              Not everything worth discussing is easily measurable.

              If I were to say that U.S. democracy is deteriorating rapidly and hasn’t been in this sort of danger in decades, would you say I’m recklessly fear-mongering since it cannot be measured in a floating-point value with a rigorous, well-defined unit of measure?

              You’re being needlessly contrarian and reductionist.

  • Muffi@programming.dev
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    14 hours ago

    Yes. And she is contributing to it with her war-preperation rhetoric. She seriously used the “upcoming war” as an excuse to make us danes work more and retire later (and also to remove a holiday) in a time where the thing we need the most is to fight for shorter work weeks.

    Her heart is in the right place, just a shame she is dumb as a brick.

    • MaggiWuerze@feddit.org
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      11 hours ago

      Her reactions are a different matter, but what do you expect her to say about the current state of affairs with russia? There’s clearly a history of escalations by russia towards european countries, especially in the last few weeks

    • gian @lemmy.grys.it
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      10 hours ago

      Yes. And she is contributing to it with her war-preperation rhetoric. She seriously used the “upcoming war” as an excuse to make us danes work more and retire later (and also to remove a holiday) in a time where the thing we need the most is to fight for shorter work weeks.

      It always amuse me how people think that with life expencanty increasing they could retire earlier and work less (and don’t want, rightly, pay more taxes).

      As for the war-preparation rhetoric, I would rather be prepared and then nothing happen than not being prepared and the something happen (if only Italy could do the same…)

      • kossa@feddit.org
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        4 hours ago

        how people think that with life expencanty increasing they could retire earlier and work less

        Shame, that people think they could have the same as all western generations since the beginning of industrialization 😅

        Yeah, of course. Productivity still rises across the board. To merely sustain our wealth, we all could work less and retire earlier, but alas, that does not work if the productivity gains get gobbled up solely by the owners ¯\_(ツ)_/¯