That judge should be held just as liable as the parents
But we’re FREE. And when open carry is forced on California, people will have so much freedom, they’ll die from freedom and go to the Lord.
This isn’t remotely similar to an onion headline. Why does it have 350 upvotes
‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens - The Onion https://theonion.com/no-way-to-prevent-this-says-only-nation-where-this-r-1848971668/
It’s very troubling that so many men in America know only one way to express emotions: anger. This kid sounds mostly just heart-broken and lonely, and yet he manages to use healthy emotions, albeit negative, to fuel an increasingly destructive rage.
Expressing sadness and loneliness as anger is bound to make both worse. It’s as if American society had given this kid only one way out of his predicament, and that way out is in fact going to cost lives.
In unrelated news, US citizens with unflattering memes of any White House official continue to be detained for national security reasons.
Tell me a story about the US without telling me it’s about the US. What a sad story.
No Way to Prevent This
The teen’s father then informed police that he had 12 registered firearms in the home and assured detectives that he would secure them, the documents show.
No one in the world needs twelve firearms.
The answer is Love and Peace!
No you see they need it to protect themselves from an evil governement that supports people, violates the constitution and harbors criminals, whilst threatening most of their allies and teaming up with genocidal regimes.
They will put these arms to their intended use any minute now…
AAaany minute now.
Come on Lemmy, you can’t have it both ways. How are we going to stage a massive revolution and die horribly in the process if we don’t have a shit ton of guns?
Fewer guns leaves more room in the safe (& budget) for ammunition.
I mean, at most you’d only need like three per person. Long gun, sidearm, and maybe a backup long gun.
I guess you could make the argument that this parent was simply trying to arm an entire family of four. It’s not a good argument. But we’ve already established that these aren’t good parents.
90’s shooters taught me that the ideal amount of weapons to carry is 9, with a 10th one ideally becoming available at the end of your adventure
Right so the guy with extra guns can give them to those with less.
I think if all civilian guns were equally distributed you do get about 3 guns per person
I mean, if you hunt deer, pheasant, small game, target shoot, and have a handgun or two for home defense, that’s already 6ish guns right there. If you have any heirlooms or collector items that are firearms, that’s a few more. I don’t have 12 guns, but I don’t have a hard time picturing why someone might, especially an entire family who hunts and does outdoorsy things. Then again I live in the western US and outdoor recreation is huge here.
Though if you don’t have any sense of responsibility, you shouldn’t have any guns either. If anyone disagrees with that, I don’t know if logic can reach them!
I don’t mean to sound insensitive to your culture, but there are other activities that can be done outdoors, can you tell your country please?
Even though I’m very glad that I live in a country where guns are heavily restricted, I can’t deny that shooting is kinda fun.
We know. There’s also paintball, and dynamite fishing!
/s
You mean bow hunting like a caveman?
We don’t have walkable cities, and in rural areas infrastructure may be so underwhelming that shooting stuff might be the best you can hope for excitement.
(Fortunately it’s usually in a non harmful way like target shooting or plinking).
Truthfully since most predators have been eliminated many species need population control.
Either the average person hunts or fish and wildlife has to go out there and perform culls.
“Hunters have been destroying the environment for centuries, and now the environment is fucked up, so the solution is more hunting!”
Really a copy paste of the “against mass shootings, we need to give more weapons to people so they can shoot the shooters”, an argument that is absurd to everyone outside of the US, and to anyone in the US who has a brain.
Yeah I spent the better part of my adulthood working to preserve lands with the park service.
Over population happens it’s an issue. Some parks like Yellowstone have been able to reintroduce wolves. It was great. Other parks actually host hunts. However sometimes when populations get out of control people have to go and cull species. Culling is most wasteful imo, and expensive for public lands
I’m sorry these are the facts. Ecology doesn’t really care how you feel about it.
Also recrational hunting didn’t cause predators to go extinct. That was a direct action of the government paying bounties to kill North America’s natural predators. Wolves would have still been killed by farmers, but the hunting was driven by the government then.
Personally I prefer reintroduction of predators. The issue is it gets political fast and every farmer within 500 miles of a planned reintroduction calls congress and lobbyists get involved. When that option is gone, managed hunting becomes the most effective in terms of practically and cost to manage populations.
Please stop comparing scientifically backed land management to conservative dog whistles
Yeah, just like people try to prevent forest fires because they feel like it’s an environmental problem, and then researchers are suggesting that preventing forest fires completely actually causes them to be worse and more frequent.
Maybe at some point the idea that when an environmental problem arises, you need to completely take control over it, is not such a good idea. And as you said, reintroducing predators that have been exterminated by hunters (whether it was from a government incentive or not doesn’t really change who did it) is probably the best solution that we have available, but it’s not done because fuckers keep on thinking that mass killing is an alternative solution. If people stopped loving hunters so much, the idea of “culling” or mass murdering a species would not be seen as a possibility, and everyone would shut up about reintroducing predators.
Justifying hunting is never, in no shape or form, helping anything. It just makes things worse for everyone (except the hunters, that are enjoying their lives of murder-hobos)
Wow talk about false equivalency.
Environments are designed for forest fires. They need dire to function. Which is why there are intensive control burn programs.
The issue is before we began trying to let our forests burn properly people spent decades not burning the forests and trying to stop every fire immediately. This led to way too much fuel being available and combined with climate and you get fires that are outside of what they should be naturally. Hopefully we can continue to correct to the point where we can let fires burn naturally. Sometimes people struggle to understand that we’ve been shaping the environment for decades and it’s going to take decades of work to fix. Just walking away would not have the intended result.
Anyway back to the need to cull or manage hunts, you clearly have no idea the ecological issues overpopulation causes. When populations get out of control you can have an environment that becomes completely overgrazed. This is a disaster for the plant communities, and causes ripple effects throughout the whole ecosystem. Leading to the extinction of threatened plant and animal species and a loss of biodiversity.
Naturally it would not get to that point. We should reintroduce predators. Until then it is absolutely necessary to cull some species. I’d much rather people go and kill a couple hundred deer every few years (most parks do not do yearly hunts) than to lose vulnerable species.
And like I said it’s not the hunters preventing predator reintroduction it’s primarily ranchers with a helping hand from NIMBYs. Truthfully I’ve never heard a case of hunters saying anything at all about reintroduction.
Sometimes the gunshots are just dinner hitting the ground
I do lots of outdoor recreation, mountain biking, swimming, hiking, basketball…
Or did you mean gun-based recreation is huge there?
On that note - I know California gets a lot of deserved flak for its gun laws, but do you think the mandatory training and safety certification before purchase is a good idea for more states to adopt? (After you complete the training you get a renewable 5 year license to buy guns within)
Sounds great, but the class must be free and succinct.
There is no training required to buy guns in CA. You have to get a firearm safety certificate (FSC), which requires passing a multiple choice test, but no training. I haven’t seen this test myself (I’m not a gun person) but I’ve heard it described as basically trivial, that anyone with some common sense could pass it with no study whatsoever. That sounds much easier than the multiple choice test for a drivers license, which millions of people have passed with no formal training. It does (for real) require some study, but you read the DMV drivers’ license booklet, take a few online practice tests, get mom or dad or another driver to explain anything that confuses you, and take the test multiple times if you don’t pass on the first try.
Training (16 hours of professional instruction iirc) is required to get a concealed carry permit in my county, but that’s a different level than just buying guns. I think other counties just give you the permit if you don’t have obvious issues preventing them.
Ah. When I was reading it on calgov it seemed like it would be more in depth. I guess it does make more sense for a CCW since a person will be carrying it on their person more often.
I do want to train and learn best practices if/when I own a gun though. Don’t want to be “that guy” when out hunting or at a range.
You’ve been to California?
California isn’t real dude. It’s an illusion The Man made up to have us think school might be fun and that your cool musician uncle would have a full head of hair, sold to us by shysters like Danny House and Zache Gosselaar-Bel.
deleted by creator
I live here lol
Why are the gun laws bad here? Because they’re so often ignored? :(
I think it’s a good idea in a stable society. This will be a hot take so please judge my ideas freely, but personally, I think gun laws only mask the fact that the American people and the American system are broken.
Instead of fixing the problems with America, the Democrats point at the guns. Instead of fixing the problems, Republicans blame the fact that we have turned against God or some nebulous spectre of communism that still haunts them decades later. Training laws would probably work in a country that has legitimacy, rule of law, some degree of social cohesion, and an economic safety net. The police in America aren’t even legally required to protect you.
Any politician who wants a hope of steering America to safer seas needs to only focus on 80/20 issues where almost everyone agrees and steer clear of anything divisive until the common sense fixes are done. My neighbors in Colorado will Vote for 420 different progressive causes, but the Democrat/Republican split isn’t representative of our opinions. Every year we fight the same battles instead of looking for the common ground that might help people want to shoot each other less and help those who do get help faster and with much less friction.
I generally agree with the principle of what you’re saying in a philosophical sense. However, there are also some empirical truths to contend with. People typically don’t like radical change, people are prone to impulsive errors in judgement (‘system 1 thinking’), an impulsive mistake with guns has far greater implications than an impulsive mistake without guns. So while yes there is a big cultural change that needs to happen, in practice you have to make small changes that marginally lead society towards a better culture.
he assured them, but dint actually do it. if someone has and wants 12 firearms, they are unlikely to fully secure them at all. they probably have it stashed all in one place or multiple places for easy acces. thats how these ammosexuals think.
they probably have it stashed all in one place or multiple places
This does read as if you’re mad no matter what they do.
Somehow i read that quote as if Trump spoke it
I am.
Need?
Who cares about need.
When it comes right down to it, nobody needs more than one of most things.
But in reality, there is a limit to how much “you” (as in someone that is trying to limit someone else’s access to something) should be allowed to limit said thing without both due process and significant cause. When something is a fundamental right (and anyone with multiple firearms is definitely of the mind that firearms are a natural extension of fundamental rights, so long as they exist at all), you, me, the government simply shouldn’t be able to declare that anyone has to show need to exercise that right.
To the contrary, suppression of rights has to be done only under extreme and unusual circumstances.
Now, from your comment, I doubt you consider the right to defense as extending to firearms. That’s fine, I’m not debating that by this comment (and won’t, it bores the fuck out of me because nobody ever has anything new to bring to the debate). I’m just saying that if something is a right, placing your idea of need on it simply isn’t acceptable.
A dozen, a hundred, a thousand, it doesn’t matter. All that matters is that the right exists. And, in the US it is a specifically enumerated right. There’s wiggle room on when rights can be curtailed, suppressed. We do it all the time. But it can’t be done lightly, and shouldn’t be based on some arbitrary, ill defined standard of need.
That being said, the role of a handgun vs a shotgun vs a rifle at least points to three use cases that can’t be met by the others. Since different calibers of ammunition have discrete properties, it can also be said that significantly different rounds would fulfill different roles (you shoot a squirrel with a .50 cal, you ain’t scraping up enough to roast). Just based on that concept, it would be easy to point to at least six different firearms being “needed” to fulfill roles.
If you have multiple people using the firearms, you can need different ones for each person.
So twelve? It really isn’t that many. I’ve seen hunters that will regularly use at least twelve different rifles in a year, sometimes more, depending on how often they can find time to hunt. Ignoring any debate about hunting being something you or I support, it is a use case that is common enough to merit the term need when it comes to the tools used to do it.
Now me? I don’t need that many. Not a hunter, don’t compete in shooting sports, don’t even target shoot as a regular hobby. But you sure as hell don’t get to decide what I do and don’t need. Nor does anyone else without the application of due process and just cause.
In the case of U.S. gun regulation at least, I don’t think a piece of paper from over two hundred years ago declaring firearm ownership as an inherent right supersedes the extreme level of gun violence that has long been occurring and largely ignored.
Limited and highly regulated gun ownership for hunting or collecting is one thing, but there wouldn’t be a need for people to amass arsenals of weapons for ‘self-defense’ if guns weren’t so prevalent in the first place. Other first world countries do not have the gun problem the U.S. has.
In the case of U.S. gun regulation at least, I don’t think a piece of paper from over two hundred years ago declaring firearm ownership as an inherent right supersedes the extreme level of gun violence that has long been occurring and largely ignored.
Trump or someone like him was inevitable. Even the “good guys” want the boot so fucking bad.
Individual gun ownership cannot hold a candle to the gross extent to which American police departments are armed and militarized. The notion of a ‘well-armed militia’ safeguarding individual rights from a tyrannical government hasn’t been relevant for most of the country’s history.
Your right to swing a fist has always ended where my nose begins. In this case, the swung fist is a cache of weapons left where a mentally unstable person can gain access to and misuse them. It’s certainly valid to own weapons, but that ownership is a liability that requires investments in safety.
You accurately describe the difference between need and want at the beginning of your comment, then ignore it at the end.
Sounds like you’re afraid of your own shadow
Whew. Careful with all that straw, don’t drop any matches
It’s possible you need the first 11 to kill the 200 people coming for you.
But, what if there are 201!!!checkmate, cynic.
I can see it adding up a lot faster than you might think.
Hypothetically, let’s say you have 2 or 3 people in your family who are avid hunters, lots of people go hunting with their spouses and/or children. And each of you have, let’s say, a deer rifle, a shotgun for turkey and waterfowl, and a .22 for small game. So off the bat that’s about 6-9 guns.
And maybe you started your kid off with a .410 or a 20 gauge shotgun and a smaller .22 rifle for them to learn the fundamentals when they were younger, and when they got older you got a 12ga and a more appropriately-sized rifle for them to use, so there’s another couple guns.
And maybe some of you have different guns for different purposes, maybe you prefer a semi auto shotgun for waterfowl and a pump for upland hunting for whatever reason, or if you live in the suburbs you might be limited to shotgun slugs and straight walled rifle cartridges in the areas you can hunt closer to home so maybe you have a gun that meets those requirements and then another rifle for when you can go hunting in the mountains.
So you can pretty reasonably have a dozen or so guns in your household from just having a couple people who like to go hunting before you even start talking about carry or home defense guns, dedicated range/target shooting guns, or collecting them, etc.
Dude, yeah, some people NOT in a major city, pretty much everywhere else in the country, have firearms lmao.
It’s gotta be people commenting this shit who’ve grown up in a major metropolitan area and never traveled outside their safe zone (aka comfort zone), or in a very strict state in general, or outside the US entirely.
My wife is a self defense instructor, she teaches basic handgun safety, women’s defense, and conceal carry, and covers more too. We’ve both inherited some family heirloom pieces dating back too the late 1800s, WWII, etc. While many may not function and are just for safe keeping and some family history (or like Curios and Relics), 12 is definitely not unheard of and probably on the low side for many families.
It’s just that is not a subject you openly talk about with acquaintances or coworkers you aren’t comfortable around, so I’m sure that original commented would be in for a surprise to know how many people own and or carry one on a daily basis!
Dude, it’s Chula Vista, no one there is going hunting for recreation.
Even in San Diego you don’t need that many/any guns because it’s not really that dangerous.
First of all, I’m talking about gun ownership in general. Not necessarily about these specific people and their community.
Secondly, unless you have the stats to show that not a single hunting license was sold to anyone with a Chula Vista address, you’re just making a pointless generalization. Sure, it might be very uncommon, but out of around 280,000 people there I think it’s pretty likely that someone there goes hunting.
Finally, that applies to target shooting and such as well, different guns for different types of shooting.
The main thing I know that people like to do here with guns is drive out to BLM land and shoot at targets in between going off-roading
Black Lives Matter Land?
Hell yeah
You just wait until the zombie apocalypse, man. Then you’ll wish you had 12 guns.
I only have two hands and holding two guns makes both of them useless.
I don’t need a gun. Let me at 'em! What’s the gun for?
For getting jammed or running out of bullets at an inopportune moment.
One for each finger.
There are many thing I don’t need yet still have
True. I have thirteen but I collect them though. And I don’t have any ammo out than some really old 22 and a box of 12g
Need? No of course not Want? Yeah +/- a few.
Seriously, how do you “dress up like Dexter Morgan”? Was he wearing a polo shirt and khakis?
I had the same thought. Maybe with a clear parka over top?
Um, ekskushe me, he wore henleys.
It’s all in the creepy smile.
That order was temporarily granted, and the father stated he would place the 12 guns in storage.
The United States is such a fucking weird place, man.
Why do these Spanish pick mes think they are white supremacists? Like I don’t get it.
Spaniards are Caucasian Europeans and they ruled their colonies with bigotry, murder and racism.
